Med. topaz.... compatibility problem?

[Dasi]

I recently read a thread about topaz and problems with compatibility. here is the thread.
http://www.lampworketc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=76858

Now for my post. I did 10 floral beads yesterday. All different colors. Same lauscha clear. I used 3 rods for all 10 beads.... So there are 2 beads made with 2 rods of clear as I ran out.
Here is a picture of the beads.
100796

The topaz beads are cracked. I am not a brown fan so I rarely do topaz as a base color. None of the other beads cracked and I almost never have cracks. They all were in the kiln together. I did not treat the topaz ones any different then the rest.

Anyone else use topaz lately that they encased?

[CCraig]

I encase all the topaz shades all the time and never have any problems. I just did a huge batch of them last week in fact preparing for Tucson.

Good Luck

[RSimmons]

I have had occasional problems with Med. Topaz cracking, though I think that it's more due to a greater sensitivity to temp. changes that it is to compatibility. I find that it thermal cracks pretty easily, more sensitive than many other transparents.

Robert

[Dasi]

I have a new batch of topaz. I encased my old batch of topaz too. I have encased hundreds of beads in the last couple of months and these are the first two to crack on me in hundreds!!! and I mean hundreds! I think it is strange that it is just the two topaz ones.

[krista michael]

Could it be the lauscha in combination with the topaz? Try encasing the topaz in effetre or vetrofond and see what happens.

[GinaJ]

I use topaz all the time, and I encase everything. I've not had any problems with cracking. (pretty beads, btw!)

[shari]

I've never had an topaz problems either. Pretty beads!!

[kimberly]

Not had a problem with any of the shades of Topaz. Mine is all pretty old, though.

[Otter's Flame]

I use a lot of topaz dark light and medium and I have not had a problem encasing it. I also use silver with it and encase it with no problems.

Otter

[Dasi]

I have new test beads in the kiln to check again..... I did not just have thermal shock cracks. some of the cracks are going in different directions.

[michey]

My opinion is there is a bad batch. I have a pound or two left of it and only use it as simple single color spacers because I can't trust it. It failed a simple stringer compatibility test and used in just simple beads, like splotched over white and black or over ivory it will craze crack. I estimate 1 out of 5 were crazed coming out of the kiln and 2-3 more cracked within the week. Some didn't crack. I tossed the entire batch of beads, cracked or not...several dozen.

It is just the topaz portion of the bead. On a couple I even had some of just the topaz melted in surface decoration pop out of the bead. Most defintley not thermal cracking. Thankfully I discovered the problem before I started shipping the beads. I have a new batch of glass in now but while it 'seems' ok I haven't had a chance to fully test the bundle.

michey

[LoriGreenberg]

Yikes. Do you know what time frame that batch is from, Michey?

[Sherry]

Heather, I've had cracks from encased topaz. This was at least 3 years ago, and I haven't had a problem since, probably since I almost never encase these days.

But I remember it well, it freaked me out. These were lentils, and the cracks weren't thermal, they were random....definitely compatabiltiy.

[PaulaD]

I had wicked bad cracking with it too. I was blaming the ASK colors that I was using with it but now it's time to rethink that since you are all having the same problems. Cracked really easily. Paula

[CCraig]

Well when this was first posted I had been having no problems at all. I got a new batch in of the pale topaz and made 20 of the 1" spree beads with it. No problems at all. Then yesterday I spent an entire day using the same glass on focals all over 2" in length. Every single bead was cracked this morning when I opened my kiln. The other large beads are fine.

In this case I did not encase the topaz but used it to encase over black and a bit of dark ivory. All animal print beads. Its really a shame too. I will have almost no animal focals for Tucson now. I used a bit under 1/2 lb of topaz yesterday.

I am using any I have left on simple single color spacers. I can't afford to lose another entire day of production.

[Dasi]

CCraig.....THIS is why I posted!
I was sure there was a problem batch of topaz and I did tests and now I am totally sure my batch is a problem batch.

I am sorry to hear a whole days work was cracked.

I have seen people post about problems before and I always make a note about any color that might have problems. I don't want to waste my time either. It really hurts when this happens. I even note a newbies problem with a color. Just because they are new does not mean they don't know what they are doing.

I wonder if there should be a running compatibility thread that lists a color that is a problem?

[swamper]

Thanks for posting this. Makes me wonder about my topaz (in the other thread) when I was leaning toward the ivory and silver.

I've had my med topaz about a year - well it was all thrown together with some about 2 years old. Maybe I should start separating batches so I'd have some compass when things go wrong.

Good idea about the compatability thread.

[*Naos*]

Which manufacturer is this? Effetre or Vetrofond? Looks like both pale and medium are having troubles?

[PaulaD]

I like the compatibility thread idea too..
Paula

[swamper]

Which manufacturer is this? Effetre or Vetrofond? Looks like both pale and medium are having troubles?

Mine was Effetre. I don't have any Vetrofond topaz to get it confused with.

[CCraig]

My problem is with the Effetre.

[Dasi]

Effetre here too!

[michey]

Effetre for me too.

Lori sorry I missed your question about the batch a couple weeks ago. Mine was all bought last year I believe. I would need to dig back through receipts to verify that.

michey

[LoriGreenberg]

Dang. I stocked up last year and just cracked into it this week...no pun intended. I've never had a problem with cracking until a couple weekends ago when I was at the ASGB meeting and someone pointed out a cracked bead. Grrrrrr.

Upon further inspection, there were two! I'm just glad I found it before Tucson. Although, before shows I freeze all my beads now to make sure if they crack, they're gonna crack before someone buys them.

The problem is, I layer all of the topaz' over each other to get richer color and I'm not sure which is bad. Hmmmm.

[barbbbeads]

I just noticed yesterday some cracks in beads with topaz that I made weeks ago. And these aren't encased. This is just topaz on top of white. These are not thermal shock cracks, just small random cracks. Pretty sure it was Effetre that I used. And the cracks are only on the surface of the topaz. Very aggravating.

[Steph'sBeadCorner]

Oh my, me too.. I used topaz over white and only where I put the topaz stringer does it have cracks..

[Felicia]

Although, before shows I freeze all my beads now to make sure if they crack, they're gonna crack before someone buys them.

Ok I'm a dunce. I have never heard of freezing your beads after they are annealed to check for cracks. Does everyone do this? I assume that you place them in the freezer and then take them out to thaw slowly or what?? Someone please explain this to me. Thanks.

[swamper]

I sure am glad others have spoken up in this thread. I hope the powers that be will investigate the glass in question and bring it to the attention of Effetre.

Edited to say, I freeze some of my beads too. I just pop them in the freezer for a while and let them warm on the counter to room temp and check for cracks. I also have a light that I can examine them with that will make crack in transparents really come into view. Don't know what kind of light it is - DH gave it to me. I has fucshia bulbs in it.

[Dasi]

I must be honest.
Until post #11 on, I was feeling very embarrassed about my post.

I knew I had a bad batch of topaz. I knew it was not my bead making technique. I feel confident in my beads, so I was very sure there was a problem with the glass. But I was feeling that the post made me look crazy and stupid.

It feels very strange when so many get on and post that they don't have problems........ I knew the glass was a problem. I was just trying to give others the heads up.

I ran tests and I had cracks. Just a plain topaz encased in clear had cracks. I also did topaz over white and I had cracks. BUT I never came back with photo's since everyone else had perfect glass. Good bead makers quickly came on to post they never had problems.....It leaves you feeling very uncomfortable when YOU have beads staring at you that are a mess.


I make so many beads and sometimes I have colors I must put aside due to cracks. About 6-8 months ago I bought a red lauscha from Frantz. I can not encase it with clear lauscha.... All three cracked... There is a lot of bad glass out there and I believe we should approach each case with some tests and then warn people. IT is so sad that you waste a day on a combination and then find the beads cracked and the day is down the drain.

[Felicia]

I must be honest.
Until post #11 on, I was feeling very embarrassed about my post.

There is absolutely no reason that you should be embarassed. I learned something new today about how to check for cracks with the freezing method. Thanks Lori and Linda for the info. There is never a reason that one should be embarassed to post to ask questions or notify of problems. We all have something to learn. No one is perfect! Now off of my soapbox.

[CCraig]

Oh Heather, don't be embarrased. I have a huge batch of smaller animal print beads that did not crack, 3 days worth of work. These were just finished up a couple days before your first post. Then on the day of the focals, every one cracked. I am not very careful about keeping batches of the same glass seperate.

I have used Effetre for years and years on these same beads and never ever have had a single problem. Why on earth would I even think of seperating the different batches that come in and tracking them when a glass has such a great record? That would require so much more storage space then what I have available for glass not to mention all the tagging and labeling of what glass came from where. What a mess!

Now, I do not want to use any of the topaz Effetre I have left and am even afraid to get more till the problem is solved. However I have 2 very large bead shows in April, just 6 weeks after Tucson and the animal print beads are always huge sellers for me. It will really be a shame if I can't make them. I typically take about $3,000 worth of animal print beads to the larger shows. That's quite a chunk of income that will be lost. :sad:

[swamper]

Heather, I'm glad you posted because I was the original poster in the other thread - folks kept saying, "Silver, Sage, Ivory, techique...."

I was feeling like you - so glad you posted - you do a lot more transparents than I do so you should know.

thank again,

Linda

[LoriGreenberg]

Heather, which topaz are you having a problem with? I use all shades and would love to be able to narrow it down to the right one. I layer them over each other a lot.

I didn't encase an opaque or encase with clear and still had cracking with just different shades of the topaz over each other.

As for the red, the cracking problem there is not a bad batch but a viscosity issue. I wrote about it after the gathering last year, if anyone wants more info.

The Myth of Coefficient of Expansion (http://lorigreenberg.com/blog/?p=585)

All 104s are not created equal!

[Dasi]

Medium topaz gave me trouble.

Lori- I expected lauscha red to work when I encase it in lauscha clear. I already know Lauscha colors do not work when they are encased in Vet. or Effetre. That I know is a viscosity issue.

Linda, I started posting in your other thread at #24. I found the whole thread very interesting since my friend was also having problems with topaz and Ivory.... I thought it was the Ivory that contributed to the problem..... Then I used the topaz with clear and found my own problems.....

[mikefrantz]

Dear everyone with cracked beads, if you send me both halves of the cracked beads I can check for stress. For those of you who could send me a list of which colors and how it was layered, I can fuse together those colors and put under a very high tech machine and see where the problems are. Since I am leaving for Italy on February 12th, please get your cracked beads/or colors used, to me at Frantz. An example would be:

Effetre Topaz 012 on top of
Vetrofond dark ivory 062

I can really find out alot using the Trident Seal test.

mike frantz

[Dasi]

Mike, I will get a package together for you tomorrow. Do you want shorts of the rods too?

[kimberly]

I am very grateful for this thread! I am going to closely check all of my beads for Tucson that have any topaz in them. Makes me not want to use my topaz also!!!

[PaulaD]

Well mine cracked immediately. They were all big beads and well annealed. It was a heartbreak but I threw them all away..
Paula

[kramdas]

Geez-why didn't I see this thread earlier today? I've got a batch in the kiln right now! White, ivory, topaz, dark topaz, and clear. Sounds like I'm in for a disappointment tomorrow morning :(

[swamper]

Mike,

I must have tossed the two halves of the bead I postd in the other thread - I made two more last night to see what would happen. They looked okay when I took them out of the kiln this morning - but then so did the other one until I pulled it off the mandrel. I'll send them to you if I see any problems. Thanks for looking into this.

[kramdas]

Well, my beads came out in one piece-for now. I think my topaz rods are very old, maybe that's my saving grace. But I'm keeping an eye on them...

[Jane P]

"Bump" - just wondered if there is anymore information on this.

[swamper]

I made two beads that I thought would crack and it's been a week and they haven't cracked yet. I haven't cleaned them yet so we'll see.

Don't know what Mike is coming up with.