Bead release

[Anno Lynke]

I am getting low on my first bottle of bead release
It is fireworks brand, easy to get at the local hobby lobby
I am having a few problems with it flakeing off.
So the question is, What is your favorite brand of bead release and where do you get it?
thanks

[Anzie]

Fusion is my favorite. And I'm from Canada so I get it from Artistry in glass.:biggrin:

[Sherry]

This is one of those subjects that if you ask ten different people, you'll likely get ten valid, but different answers.

Everyone's got a favorite; right now I'm totally sold on Bucket 'o Mud. I just find it incredibly durable, especially since I'm fairly violent with some of my beads.

I don't think there's really any such thing as a "bad" or "best" bead release, it's what will work for you. If you can, try out a few different brands.....I've heard great things about almost all of them, they all have their fans.

[Hayley]

That depends on what type of bead you make.

I use Sludge for smaller beads and Foster Fire Smooth N Tuff for long beads. You need to crack the Foster Fire bead release BEFORE putting the bead on mandrel in water tho . . . but I never had a long bead stuck since switching.

[SassyGlass9]

OK, Hayley - I am curious, and want to make sure I understood you properly (I'm having a DUH day!). With the Foster Fire, you crack the bead release after the bead comes out of the kiln but before you put it in water to soak? May I ask why?

Reason I am asking about this is I am getting ready to try another brand of release (I've been using Dip & Go Sludge and am not totally in love with it once it gets older). I've heard that Foster Fire is fantastic for larger beads so I was planning to try it. But I'd never heard the tip about cracking the release prior to soaking.

any info you can share will be much appreciated!! : )

Rene'

[jaci]

Hayley I am confused???

I love my Foster fire. I thin it with some water. (ALWAYS BOTTLED!!! softeners in the water will ruin your bead release)

[crystalflipz]

KRAG Mud - get it from Kittrell Riffkend, the folks who make it. This stuff is wonderful, cleans out with a pipe cleaner and water, and I've even used it with Boro. The one catch to the KRAG is it works best when used the same day the mandrels are dipped.

[Zooziis]

Foster Fire Smooth and Tuff. I can't find anything I don't like about it.

I sell it, because I like it so much and think it works exceptionally well for bead presses.

I used BOM, and that was good, too.

I find Foster Fire Smooth and Tuff comes off the mandrels/cleans up a bit easier then BOM, but they are both the top two that I would recommend.

Bead release is a very personal item, more then one would think. I know some folks that swear by something that others just swear about. But I don't find any flaking with the S&T or BOM.

Good luck!

[Tanner Studios]

I keep going back to Slugde Plus from Arrow springs. I wish there was a prefect release but there isn't. Just try them all and find the one that bests suited to your style.

Krag releases the bead better than the rest but like Carol said if you don't use it the same day wash it off and re-dip. Smooth and tuff is the same kinda thing. Although it has a longer shelve life for dipped mandrels three days max. And it won't work well with the heat needed for boro ( never tested Krag with boro. ). BOM works great until you need to thin it. Slugde will crack and fall off under the heat of boro but it will hold and release even thought it totally came off the mandrel on both side of the bead. One trick is to not allow slugde to cool. As long as your not heating and cooling to long its fantastic.
I think I'll try some Fusion next.
Scott

[Anno Lynke]

Thanks for the input everyone.
I guess I will try a few different ones.
Is there anyone that sells a powder that you mix your self?
I have found the stuff I am using now, dries out.
I added water, but I dont think it is the same.

[jaci]

I keep going back to Slugde Plus from Arrow springs. I wish there was a prefect release but there isn't. Just try them all and find the one that bests suited to your style.

Krag releases the bead better than the rest but like Carol said if you don't use it the same day wash it off and re-dip. Smooth and tuff is the same kinda thing. Although it has a longer shelve life for dipped mandrels three days max. And it won't work well with the heat needed for boro ( never tested Krag with boro. ). BOM works great until you need to thin it. Slugde will crack and fall off under the heat of boro but it will hold and release even thought it totally came off the mandrel on both side of the bead. One trick is to not allow slugde to cool. As long as your not heating and cooling to long its fantastic.
I think I'll try some Fusion next.
Scott

I leave my smooth and tuff for weeks and have never had any issues. I try and dry them faster than if they would air dry though, i think this helps. I just dip them all and leave them infront of the kiln for a min and they are perfect! The thing with smooth and tuff is that it has to be thin, and it takes a bit of time to figure out what is too thin and what works. I can almost see the mandrels through my smooth and tuff. It has a weird surface tension that the faster you dip the more sticks. People say "go as slow as possible" I am not that patient, I dip and tap the sides of the jar like it was a noise maker a few times and it is perfect!

I actually used straight up kiln wash for a while that I mixed from powder. worked great for me! I also flame dried that because I thought it was not as liable to flake off. just mix until thin pancake batter consistency.

[Hayley]

OK, Hayley - I am curious, and want to make sure I understood you properly (I'm having a DUH day!). With the Foster Fire, you crack the bead release after the bead comes out of the kiln but before you put it in water to soak? May I ask why?

Reason I am asking about this is I am getting ready to try another brand of release (I've been using Dip & Go Sludge and am not totally in love with it once it gets older). I've heard that Foster Fire is fantastic for larger beads so I was planning to try it. But I'd never heard the tip about cracking the release prior to soaking.

any info you can share will be much appreciated!! : )

Rene'

Rene - I learned that in Affleck's class. Yes, you take the beads on the mandrels from the kiln and crack the bead release (holding the mandrel with a vice grip) BEFORE putting in water.Sometimes I don't even need to put in water, just twist the bead off the dried bead release all the way off the mandrel. The reason is that kiln fired Foster Fire turns into "concrete" with water, just like cement!

Jaci - I do thin my Foster Fire with water . . . and I use tap water and never had a problem (I read that the new ones LB Supply makes do however, so if bottled/distilled water work for you, keep using those!). What I meant in my post was cracking the kiln fire release . . . see above.

Scott - I can up mandrels dipped in Foster Fire for about a week, a week and a half . . . when the release gets little brown specs, I just warm it in the flame gently and that seems to make the specs go away and "revive" the bead release so it doesn't flake.

[jaci]

*ahhh light bulb!! I just got what you were saying Hayley* I thought you were talking about applying the release, not taking the beads off afterwards!!! :lol:

[beadworkstudio]

Those of you who use BoM, do you have problems getting the beads off the mandrels? I love it because it's so much more durable than anything else for me, but getting the beads off is a huge chore. Maybe I need to thin it a bit?

[Sherry]

Those of you who use BoM, do you have problems getting the beads off the mandrels? I love it because it's so much more durable than anything else for me, but getting the beads off is a huge chore. Maybe I need to thin it a bit?

I use it really, really thin. See the mandrel through the release-almost thin. Getting beads off the mandrels can be a bit challenging, I soak beads with warm soapy water, and use a vise grip very close to the bead to hold the mandrel, while gently starting to move the bead until it spins freely.

If a bead is still stubborn, get it so that it's moving on the mandrel, and put it back in to soak for a few minutes, that always does the trick. For me it's a trade-off....I'm more than happy to spend a bit more time taking the beads off when I'm sure of the performance of the release when I'm doing big, heavily manipulated beads.

[Hayley]

Those of you who use BoM, do you have problems getting the beads off the mandrels? I love it because it's so much more durable than anything else for me, but getting the beads off is a huge chore. Maybe I need to thin it a bit?

Sheila,

Have you tried Foster Fire? I have been making those huge (2+ oz) floral beads I learned from Cynthia's/glassactcc class and Foster Fire holds! Lots f poking and about four-five layers.

[Vangy]

I have not had any issues getting my beads off since switching to BOM. However, with Fireworks brand (the first brand I tried) I ended up with many garden stakes. I even tried the freezer trick too no avail with them.

[Kym]

I love FF S&Tuff when its fresh but mine seems to have issues as it ages. I even use distilled water to thin it but it remains the same and sort of goes rough after a while. I wonder if it the result of temp. changes though our summer here in Brisbane was quite mild this year. Even rough though, I don't have many issues at all with it.

Kym

[beadworkstudio]

Sheila,

Have you tried Foster Fire? I have been making those huge (2+ oz) floral beads I learned from Cynthia's/glassactcc class and Foster Fire holds! Lots f poking and about four-five layers.


Yep, I'm using Smooth and Tough now, but I'm almost out. I have some BoM in the fridge. I'm going to use that up before I decide which to buy.

I like that I can leave dipped mandrels for weeks with BoM and they are fine. Smooth and Tough gets flaky if I leave them more than a few days. I guess I have to decide if I'd rather spend time bouncing mandrels to release the beads or cleaning and re-dipping mandrels before every torch session. ;)

[jaci]

I love FF S&Tuff when its fresh but mine seems to have issues as it ages. I even use distilled water to thin it but it remains the same and sort of goes rough after a while. I wonder if it the result of temp. changes though our summer here in Brisbane was quite mild this year. Even rough though, I don't have many issues at all with it.

Kym

Kym it needs to be SUPER mixed after a while. Especially if you don't use it that often. Drop a few ugly beads into the bottle and shake the hell out of it. if that is not making it the same you may need to throw it in a blender, or take a hand held mixer to it. It is OK and still works great if the mandrels look a bit "rough" (kindda like sandpaper). It still works great, and comes off great.

This thread has LOTS of information about FF S&T, and what it can go through with out being ruined!
"How to ruin your bead release" (http://www.lampworketc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=61810)

[PaulaD]

I always crack the bead before putting it in water too. I learned that from Affleck too!
I do it with any release. I must tell you that I have used BOM dipped mandrels 2 years later and it was like I dipped them yesterday! Plus they have better caps than anybody... Paula

[Emily]

Is there anyone that sells a powder that you mix your self?

Alice's Bead Release. Comes in big containers of white powder that last forever. It works out to be cheaper than just about anything else. (I haven't done a formal comparison, so that's just my impression.) Alice's isn't flame-dry, unfortunately. I used it for years, before switching to Foster Fire Smooth & Tuff, and I'd be using it again if it were flame dry. (As a matter of fact, I still have a whole lot, and I think I will get it out and use it again. I'll just have to plan ahead and make sure I get my mandrels dipped in time.)

EDIT: Here's the website for ordering Alice's. It looks like they've built the shipping cost into the price -- it used to be that the release was cheap and the shipping cost was high -- now it's just one cost. I still expect that it works out to be pretty economical.

http://www.alicesstainedglass.com/release.htm

Smooth & Tuff is making me nuts! Sometimes it's terrific, and sometimes it's -- crap. Worse than useless. Flakes if you look at it, falls off the mandrel, gets bits that stick to the bead and won't come off. (Alice's can flake if you use presses, but the flaky bits don't usually stick to the bead if they get on there.) What's making me crazy is that I can't figure out why it's so good sometimes and so not good sometimes. I have mixed the bejeebers out of it -- the full James Bond treatment -- shaken AND stirred. I have thinned it. I have tried it less thin. (I have never used water-softener water in it, so that's not the problem.) I thought at first that my bottle had been ruined in shipping by being overheated or something, so Robin Foster sent me a sample bottle to try. The sample bottle worked, so I went back and tried the old bottle, after adding water because it had dried out and mixing, mixing, mixing. For quite a while it was great, and then suddenly, even though the release was from the same bleeping bottle, it was falling off the mandrels, sometimes before I touched them with the glass. Why is this flipping stuff so TOUCHY? And can anybody help me with what it's touchy about?

When Smooth & Tuff behaves, it's great. It's flame dry, which I like, and it's so easy to clean out of the bead holes. That's the main reason why I even care that it's giving me problems, rather than just writing it off.

Fusion is my fall back. It is dependable. It is flame dry and has a good solid hold for whatever use you're making of it. It's harder to get the beads off than it is with Smooth & Tuff or Alice's. Fusion is harder to clean out of bead holes than Smooth & Tuff, but I have bead buddies who clean out Fusion beads by just running the mandrels through them under water. (Alice's, unfortunately, is a little hard to get out of beads. It's easy to get the beads off the mandrels, but the beads take more cleaning.) Fusion's full name is Bead Separator.

[alexm]

Asking what's the best bead release is like asking what's the best all around glass, there is no such thing. It all depends on a lot of factors such as what kind of glass you use, the kind of beads you use, whether or not you use a press, etc.

My two personal favorites are Alice's and Fusion.

I use Fusion for boro because no matter what I do, it doesn't flake off the mandrel in a hot flame. The flip side is that it can be hard to remove beads from the mandrel. I use vice grips to loosen the beads.

I really like a mixture of 50% Alice's and 50% Fusion for soft glass beads. It doesn't flake and the beads come off easily afterward.

You can always experiment and make up your own bead release. I've been playing with my own formula for a while and I think I've almost got it right.

[Anno Lynke]

Asking what's the best bead release is like asking what's the best all around glass, there is no such thing. It all depends on a lot of factors such as what kind of glass you use, the kind of beads you use, whether or not you use a press, etc.
.

I realized this when I asked the original question, but with the answers here it will be easier to eliminate a few choices without having to try them all.

[Beckah]

Arrowsprings Dip 'n Go Sludge mixed 50/50 with FF Smooth & Tough. The Dip 'n Go rarely breaks or flakes. I left it in my garage and it took heat and cold and still kept working with a bit of distilled water thinning every so often. But it could be tough to get off the mandrel. FF Smooth & Tuff flaked and broke on me on what seemed like every other mandrel and I keep it indoors after reading that it didn't like high heat. Mixing them together, I get a tough bead release that is much easier to get off the mandrel.

[Anno Lynke]

I ordered some bucket of mud it showed up yesterday.
I only had time for one bead but i wanted to test it
It coated the mandrel great,didnt flake at all when I flame dried it
I pulled the bead off the mandrel this mourning it one easy twist and off it came.
I am very happy with its preformance so far, but that was only one bead