Frantz Billing
 

First off, I love Frantz Art Glass and always have.

However, I think it's time for them to really evaluate and change their online billing procedure. It's always been cumbersome, but apparently in the last few months, the procedure for charging for a glass order via their website has gotten even more convoluted.

Here's how it is now, based on my experience this last week.

I ordered glass from their website last Thursday. That day, I received an email with the order details, and a total cost with shipping, which is and has always been an estimate.

Friday, I received another email, with the PDF of the sales order, complete with adjusted shipping totals, which was an amount slightly larger than the first total from Thursday.

Friday, I also receive a receipt from Paypal for the Frantz order, that has a *third* total amount, which is higher than the first two.

Confused, I called Frantz this morning to ask why I was overcharged. The service rep (who seems frustrated with this process as well) told me that the PayPal receipt is just a hold - that there will be a **fourth** amount - the real amount - after the order is invoiced. Which will happen tomorrow, because the order hasn't even been pulled yet.

Folks, this seems like there is an extra, unneeded step here. I understand the need to estimate shipping. That could account for the hold from PayPal, and one of the "estimated" totals. But the other one is superfluous and confusing. There has to be a better way. Why send the PDF sales order if the total isn't right? There's already an estimate from the website. You should wait to send the PDF until the total is correct, in my opinion.

I'll still buy from Frantz - I have for over a decade. I wanted to voice my opinion here, since it seems that even the customer service person at Frantz thinks this procedure is confusing, and she says she has to explain it to people a lot.

My guess would be that they're not going to pull the glass until they have confirmation that they're going to be paid - which generates one set of paperwork.

Once the glass is pulled, cut, weighed, and packaged then they can come up with the actual cost and put it throughout to Paypal.

There could be a refund if the first estimate is higher than the actual final cost and that will generate more receipts - it's PayPal not the vendor

Same thing happens with Mountain glass when using Paypal.

As I understand it this is all happening in the background when using credit cards, it's just transparent.

I guess if you use your credit card directly instead of Paypal it will be both easier for you and the vendor - but perhaps less secure - which is the point of PayPal

You need to read the post again. I understand the need to estimate and hold. But there's an extra unnecessary step.

*raises hand*

Frantz and.... Paypal?


Did you use a paypal credit card? Because while I sympathize and agree!!! The word paypal in conjunction with Frantz kind of stopped me cold. ;)

I'm not sure I understand what you mean. I use my Paypal debit card at Frantz, and have for years. This is the first time there's been any issue - and it's Frantz's issue, not Paypal's.

Kandice - Have you thought about sending Mike an email, or just calling and talking to him?

He's not there - I talked to the receptionist for awhile, and suggested they consider changing it. I'm not looking for a solution to the problem here (that can only come if Frantz is receptive to the suggestion) - I just wanted to post my frustration and discuss with other customers, like people do when they're frustrated with a business. It would be nice if Frantz responded to this post, but I don't expect them to.

Ahhhh, well there goes my question about the Paypal thing.

I don't like the way they do the check out system either. It just makes things take longer to get done. Not efficient at all.

Hi Everyone!

We would be glad to explain the process for placing orders at Frantz Art Glass.

If you place an order on our website, you will receive a confirmation email from the website. This email will have your order number, what you wish to order and estimates of the shipping. This email confirms that your order was placed and it now is collected by the salespeople at Frantz Art Glass

We receive your web order and it is input into our accounting system and a Sales Order is created. This Sales Order is emailed to our customers for their review to make sure all is as it should be. We run an "authorization" of your credit card for the estimated total of your order. This is an authorization which places a hold on the funds until we can do the final invoice and capture those funds, this usually happens within 1-2 days of authorization.

This is also a great time to add or delete items. If you have any questions, this is a good time to inquire.

When you receive the Sales Order it indicates your order is now going to the Warehouse for fulfillment and shipping. When you buy glass you purchase a 1/4lb perhaps. When we pull the glass for your order, depending on the diameters, you might receive .25, .26 or .27 of that 1/4lb. (If you wish to receive less-just write "underweigh" on your order in the comments section and you will receive .23 or .24...or .25)

Once your order is pulled it is packed and this information is sent to our invoice person who captures the exact charges to your credit card. At this time you receive a 3rd email indicating the "actual" cost of your order and the final shipping amount. Your order then ships that day.

I hope I have helped explain the process at Frantz. We hope that when you receive the sales order, you do look it over and if you have any questions, please be sure to contact us.

If you wish to ask Mike any questions, please do not hesitate to write him a private message or just email to our sales department:
To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 1 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


Thanks everyone-have an excellent week!
Your friends at Frantz Art Glass

I, for one, have never had any issue with it. *shrug* Maybe I am just weird??

From what Kandice wrote, the third email she got is not the final one. She was told to expect another one and that one would be the final one.

Yes, there are four amounts, and there really should only be three. One from the website as a confirmation of you order, one when Frantz pre-holds a dollar amount to make sure the money is there, and one as a PDF invoice with the real total amount. The Sales Order is superfluous, because it doesn't give the right amount. It didn't used to be this way - the rep told me this was a change made a few months ago, and that it was confusing a lot of customers. So I am not the only one who thinks this is a cumbersome process.

You mean I'm actually supposed to be looking at it? :lol:

I keep my eyes shut.

So the first response is just an automated computer list echoing what I thought I ordered along with an estimated shipping cost

and the second one is a human confirming what I ordered before that list gets sent to the warehouse to be filled along with the estimated shipping cost

and the third is a warning of what they think they are going to bill my credit card as they put a hold on that amount with my credit card

and the forth is what they are actually going to bill my credit card because the charges are actually for the percentage of a pound closest to a quarter pound that they were able to gather in cut rods of glass plus the actual shipping charges the package incurred.



Now I know why I am not running a business.

At least they're only emails and not paper. If I had my choice, I'd like to see my order from the web, and the final sales order. The extras, mehhhh, don't care. Frantz's clerk's are always careful and to date, I've only had one mix up in 7yrs.

I, too, placed an order last Thursday. So, it's been a week and I've received ONLY the acknowledgment that my order was received. I sent an email today asking if it had been shipped yet and asking why they don't use Priority mail instead of UPS if it has been requested. I KNOW my order will easily fit in a medium flat rate box (FREE from USPS!, with FREE tracking! and FREE insurance! Which Mike charges for), and the shipping would be $5.00 less than they are quoting to ship through UPS. USPS will even pickup packages for free! I paid via CC. I've ordered from Mike for several years, and this is the first time it's taken a week with only an order confirmation. Usually, I order one day, get a confirmation the next day, then two days later get a "look at your order", after which it ships the next day.

ETA: the price quoted on my order was for "priority mail" through USPS, not UPS, as I thought.

Yup, I used to be able to order on a weekend and have it by the next Friday. Now I need to order at least 3 weeks ahead of when I think I might need it. In that 3 weeks I might need something else. Plus, I have even less of an idea of what my order total will be because they don't do the distributor on the site any more (been a long time since that was available)...

UPS FREE, USPS Not Free
 

A good question. Our free shipping that we are offering is for UPS not USPS. So if you rather have it shipped USPS, then we will charge for shipping USPS, but if you have spent $100 or more and will allow us to ship UPS, then it is free.

For USPS shipments, they are insured for $50 by the postal service. If the package is more than $50, then there is additional charges for insurance.

I hope this helps.

Mike Frantz

I didn't spend $100...only just over $60, with your UPS and insurance fees, but USPS priority flat rate with its free $50 insurance would still be a good bit less than your stated shipping and insurance. Postage for a medium flat rate priority mail box is $11.30, including insurance and tracking....not $16.28 + $1.70 for insurance. That's right at $7.00 difference give or take a few cents. But, has my order shipped yet?

ps: I didn't ask anything about free shipping, because I knew I didn't spend enough to get free shipping this time. I just asked about method of shipping and the difference in price....also the time frame for delivery between UPS and USPS Priority mail. But thank you for clarifying the defining point for free shipments.

ETA: I was mistaken on the UPS thing. The $16.28 +1.70 insurance charges on a $43. Order was for "priority mail" through USPS, although flat rate priority is 3 day delivery and $7. cheaper.

Hi Tillie

We would like to let you know that your order shipped on Monday (March 16) via USPS Priority Mail Flat Rate box. We tracked your order and it should be delivered very soon as it is at your local post office today.

We did follow your advice on your web order that you wished us to ship Priority Flat Rate Box and your shipping was $12.65.

We thank you for letting us know you preferred the Flat Rate box with your comments on your web order. That helps a lot.

Flat Rate boxes can only hold so much glass safely, but your order fit perfectly!!

Thanks again, we value your business
Mike Frantz

I was disappointed the last time I ordered when the new Cim came in. I ordered Sakura then was emailed and told they made a pricing mistake and it was more expensive than what they had advertised. I would just think it was good customer service to still give the advertised price to the customers who had already ordered. This has happened to me twice now. I will still most likely order from Frantz but I am always careful to read all my emails and shipping notices now.

Thank you, Mike. I received the box today. I have to assume that you took my box to the USPS facility and had them print out the label, since it was $12.65. You might save money by printing your own labels through USPS online, as the same shipment would have only been $11.30.

Mike, check your pm's. I have a question that is better handled privately.

This issue has been resolved to everyone's satisfaction. Mike shipped everything I ordered in a timely manner and shipped it the way I had asked them to ship. I appreciate that Mike worked with me on this, and did so in a pleasant way. I'll continue to order from Mike.

Mike, I really think you could cut it down to two emails if the website automatically placed the hold on estimated funds as part of the submit order/order confirmation process, and then a second final invoice email once the order has been packed and weighed for shipment with the corrected charges. The order fulfillment/warehouse pick list is internal and shouldn't be part of the customer process.

Frantz always ships mine via USPS, because I am close by and I usually don't order a ton of glass all at once. I always get my orders pretty quickly, which is one reason I almost always order from Frantz. And their customer service is usually really great.

I just think maybe they can cut out one or two of the email notices to reduce confusion about the amount totals.

I agree, the Sakura price debacle was a bit disappointing, but I understand that mistakes happen, and this would have been really costly to them had they honored the price mistake on such an expensive glass.

I'd love to shop at Frantz... I put stuff in my cart and abandon it all the time. But I can't cope with the mystery shipping stuff. I want to place my order, and be billed right that moment, with the actual amount - I run my finances FAR too close to the bone most of the time to play Shipping Roulette. NO other place I shop operates this way. It makes me sad.

Mike, thanks for coming in to this thread and explaining things.

I have always ordered from you and will continue !

--Helene