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Tips, Techniques, and Questions -- Technical questions or tips

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  #1  
Old 2011-04-09, 5:54pm
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Default How do you make it a cheap hobby?

Glass work of any type isn't a cheap hobby so I though it might be useful to get some ideas for how to get involved without breaking the bank. A Hot Head is certainly a good place to start. I'll add cheap pliers and mashers from Harbor Freight that have been mentioned in other threads. How about "found glass"? Worth playing with? I use a steel cookie tray for bench protection and an old piece of sheet metal for protection on the far side of the bench. No reason not to mash your own frits. How else to save some bucks?
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  #2  
Old 2011-04-09, 6:04pm
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I found some stainless steel tools at the flea market, they have little blades of various shapes on the ends of a thing about the size of a nut pick.
Found some bead reamers there too that fit into a pin hole vise.
I forgot to mention: I went to the metal scrap yard & found a piece of brass about 5x5 and maybe 1/16th of in inch thick for $4 or 5 dollars. I also got a sheet of stainless for $12. I don't know if they are good buys or not.
I got a bronze rod from the welding shop when I went to buy my flow check for the propane, and I'm going to make my own pick & hope it works. They gave me the bronze rod.

Last edited by Eileen; 2011-04-09 at 6:06pm.
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  #3  
Old 2011-04-09, 6:05pm
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I've used wine bottles but even on a Barracuda with tanked oxy it took a while to melt.
Some studios (like myself) wind up with lots of "scrap" glass after classes... I bag it up in one pound increments and sell it cheap. Draw back is the glass may not be marked/tagged... but it's all compatible.
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  #4  
Old 2011-04-09, 6:39pm
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Has anyone ever tried to melt those little glass disks used in fish tanks?
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  #5  
Old 2011-04-10, 4:48am
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This topic is harder to search, so here's a link to a great thread about frugality:

http://www.lampworketc.com/forums/sh...d.php?t=155691

It has great information
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  #6  
Old 2011-04-10, 5:12am
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I fear the best way to make it cheap is to .back.slowly.away, LOL.
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  #7  
Old 2011-04-10, 6:26am
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In the beginning, my thoughts were "I can save money by making my own beads" For those of you now ROTFLYAO, that clearly, for me anyway, is impossible. Because, sooner or later, and many beads into it, your head says, "Hey, we should sell these!" Then you start owning tents and displays and lights and busts and earring racks and pipe and drape, show fees, travel expenses.....

This year, I am being very cautious with my money. Silver charms that cost me $3.50 last year are $7.80. Rope chain was $6.50, now $13...yipe! And customers really aren't that knowledgeable about the humongous hike in silver prices, so I'm trying other necklace materials to stop having a huge silver inventory, and I don't want people to balk at price hikes either. I have a huge show at the end of April, hopefully, feeling out the market a little bit, having some lower priced items available will help, but I just don't know..

One area that I do have control over is my inventory, particularly my glass inventory.

As you may have noticed by my recent garage sale postings, I'm downsizing. Since there isn't a 12 step program for people like me, I'm turning over a new leaf in order to try to make it a less expensive hobby/business.

What I have learned:
Turns out you really don't use, nor have to have, every fricking color of glass and/or COE that comes on the market. I have 10 year old Moretti circus colors like Lemon Yellow and Carrot Red that I NEVER USE. Just use what you have and occasionally barter for a rod or two of what you want to try. AND get RID of what you don't use. Someone else is madly in love with Lemon Yellow, I can assure you... Stop hoarding every shade a color comes in-your customers are not really impressed in how many shades of opal yellow you have. Don't even go to the land of how many variants of Dark Ivory I have....embarassing.

Oddly, you don't have to have 5 pounds of every color. Order 1/4 pound. "It might become rare" is not a reason to buy a crapload of every weirda** color that comes out in glass. Most don't become rare, they go the way of the dodo because they are irritating to use (Chocolatta). I have a crapload of yellow ice because I use it as a base in all my silver glass beads, and since it was odd, I didn't want to run out. At last check, I will run out in 2097...

Take a class with Michael Barley. He is fantastic for "use what you have an create your own colors" frugality.

Nothing is actually cheaper if you buy 100 of it. Because, unless you intend to make and sell 100 bead pens/cake servers, were they really a bargain??? (rhetorical) **Kudos to BehindTheScenes-wanted something at a better price, asked around and others wanted in. We should do more of that..

Don't get me started on Frit blends, Shards, silver foil/leaf/wire, tutorials..

Ugh, I'm going back down to the garage to try to sell off more stuff I couldn't possibly use in this lifetime...
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  #8  
Old 2011-04-10, 7:02am
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Charmaine how did you determine the length of time your Ice glass would last? Totally curious here, lol.

My tip is to go to a welding shop and buy the boxes of welding rods you use to make mandrels. Make them all into mandrels and trade what you don't need for glass. There are plenty of us that don't like to make them.
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  #9  
Old 2011-04-10, 7:06am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zen-mom View Post
I've used wine bottles but even on a Barracuda with tanked oxy it took a while to melt.
This - my blue bottle glass took forever on a Minor.
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  #10  
Old 2011-04-10, 7:59am
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When I started out I had lots of fusible class. So I cut strips of the glass and used that. I still use it when I need a color in 96 that I don't have. Some days when I am bored, I will even pull the class strips into rods.
I agree with a lot of the points Charmaine made. Sooner or later your cheap hobby will get expensive!
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  #11  
Old 2011-04-10, 7:59am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zen-mom View Post
I've used wine bottles but even on a Barracuda with tanked oxy it took a while to melt.
Bottle-n-jar glass is formulated to stiffen as soon as the mold chills it a little - very short workability range.

This is less of a problem for fusing or melting a lot at once in a furnace, but with a torch your really hot spot is smaller.

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  #12  
Old 2011-04-10, 8:08am
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A stainless steel oil pan changing tray is in the automotive section at WallyWorld which was almost large enough to cover my entire work surface and was only $10.

I use the marble bases off of discarded trophy's to pile my frit on, rest hot tools on, lay silver foil on before rolling onto a bead, etc. Everyone has old trophy's or you can pick some up at a thrift store.

The inner brass components out of old doorknobs make excellent tools when attached to a dowel.

Stained glass scraps make pretty, mono-color beads that you can accent with silvered stringer made from the same scrap or etch. Making hollows keeps the colors from becoming too dense and dark.

I just bought the 10lb minimum of rods from a welding supply shop and am in the process of cutting them up for mandrels to use both for lampworking and for bead displays.

My latest cheapo bead display is a section of log from a cypress tree downed during Hurricane Gustov with holes drilled in the top to rest bead filled mandrels in - turned out very pretty!
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  #13  
Old 2011-04-10, 6:04pm
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This might depend on luck, but if there's a motor rewinding shop nearby, ask about large motor brushes. Big motors and generators have big carbon brushes and maybe they'll have a scrap or obsolete one or two. I just found one in my scrap bin that was about 2" x 3" x 3/4" and tried it as a marver. Worked great. If you can get somebody in a machine shop to plunge a ball-nose end mill in it, instant marble maker.

Every time I change windshield wipers I save a couple of the nice stainless steel bars from each side of the rubber blade. They're flat and a few mm wide and as long as the wiper. Very springy. Not sure what to do with them yet- any ideas?
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Old 2011-04-10, 6:30pm
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It's not a cheap hobby and I don't think that it can be safely made so.You mentioned torch, work surface and glass. You neglected a kiln to keep your work from shattering and a ventilation system to keep you from doing yourself irreparable harm. If you can't safely ventilate your work area then you should not light your torch.

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  #15  
Old 2011-04-10, 7:03pm
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have not read through this yet, but wanted to post before going to bed, I will check in later to read the rest.

It can be not so expensive. I have NO budget for glass. I just had to get to a point where that happened after a while. My only expense besides a bit of glass here and there is electric, and about every 6 months a tank of propane.

I have a minor on an oxygen concentrator. The minor has saved me SO MUCH MONEY compared to the amount of cash I was spending on gas for the HH. (I was on a HH for 10 years +)I was going through a tank of propylene once a month at $35-40 a month. Now with the oxy con, ($80 w/ shipping, second hand online) I go through a tank of propane about every 6 months @ $13.99 a tank fill at BJ's (usually 4 months in the summer). My Minor I got with hoses and regulators for $150 in the garage sale here Ventilation, with a good (but cheep-it was a good find) fan, some not so expensive exhaust stuff from home depot, and the BF and some duct tape I have a great system. You could even play outside with a fan for cross wind to really minimize this cost, but if you move indoors this is a MUST (there are a few threads about building ventilation, most are quite frugal) SAFETY SHOULD NEVER BE COMPROMISED for cost. there are less expensive ways to be safe. I have the same old pair of diddy's that I work with as well. Diddy's are IMO A MUST as well. Not a bad investment, for about 50 bucks? You can also batch anneal your beads. Use a crock pot w/ vermiculite or sand to cool your beads, or fiber blanket which can be bought by the foot for a good price if you call most vendors. You only need 1 foot most of the time, and most vendors- i like arrow springs- are more than happy to supply this for only a few bucks.

Glass..... Yes I am a junkey! Do I have every color>}?? NO NO NO... (but I want them). I order what is on sale, I use regular clear, and order colors I like, or want to use. I use what I have. I make my own frit blends, and I find things that work for tools. I just have always been the type to find unconventional or household methods of "how can I do that". I find tools a tag sales, and flea markets, and even have BF saying to me now "hey hunny, can you use this?" (love him!) AND check out the garage sale for some great deals! Also offer to trade something you have for something you need. It sometimes works not always.. but sometimes. Also be on the look out for shorts in the garage sale, many people just give them away... and sign up for ROAGK

Learning... Learn by doing, and R E A D everything you can on glass! tada!
Your initial setup may not really be ideal to start selling your works of glass art, but there is no reason to let that stop you from enjoying and learning about the glass itself! This may be one of those hobbies that you can afford to put more into at a later date, but don't want to put it down now.. THATS OK, as long as you realize the standards we set in selling our glass. Be safe, and don't misrepresent your goods. If you intend to sell your work should be cleaned and annealed properly. SAFETY then FUN.. then profit (well maybe, if that is what you want)

Dont let anyone deter you from torching, if that is what you want to do!
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  #16  
Old 2011-04-10, 7:34pm
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Robert, I hope to have a kiln later this summer and won't have sufficient skills developed to worry about selling anything until then, if ever. Most of the small lab oriented items I make are for my own use and lend themselves to torch annealing, as has been done for a very long time. It would have been nice to set up in the house, but the ventilation issue made it impossible. Thus, I've set up my work area in a large garage with a fan and cross-flow in three directions. Ventilation isn't much of an issue there, but temperature seems to alternate between freezing and roasting.
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Old 2011-04-10, 10:19pm
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None of it is ever going to be cheap, really...but I'll give you a clue - stay away from the "silver glass". It's way too expensive for what it is and you never really know what you're going to get from bead to bead, or batch to batch. That and the high dollar expense is why I don't use it. I make bead sets so I like my beads to be consistent from one to the next. But that's me. Can't change this ol' lady.

As far as boro goes, stock up on the frits because you can put layers of the fine opaque frits over a base of clear enough to cover and make a good base bead for other colors. You can use the colored rods over clear also.
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Old 2011-04-10, 11:23pm
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This hobby will never be cheap.

But if you want to find some cool shaping tools to help make barrel beads, shallow spoons of all shapes and sizes work well. I have several demitasse and teaspoons I like to use. You can get your base shape down, cool the spoon a little, pick up a little frit or enamel, use it to lay on more color, dump the frit/enamel, then return to shaping. Works great.

Just make absolutely sure they are stainless steel.
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Old 2011-04-11, 5:36am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by echeveria View Post
I fear the best way to make it cheap is to .back.slowly.away, LOL.
Yeah, it's too late for me - I have already spent far too much!
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Old 2011-04-11, 5:40am
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'bout the only way is to find a sugar Daddy, or Mommy...and I'm fairly certain that doing so comes with it's own cost.
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Old 2011-04-11, 9:07am
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For glass in 90, 96 or 104 COE, keep an eye on Frantz's sales announcements by getting on their mailing list. Or shop with Howaco Glass as she has great prices all year round. Check out the Vendors list here in LE because all the vendors have something that the others may not have.
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  #22  
Old 2011-04-11, 5:01pm
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There's some excellent advice in this thread.

I think Jaci has hit the nail on the head on this point.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jaci View Post
I use what I have.
I need to aspire to do the same!
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  #23  
Old 2011-04-12, 5:58pm
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The only way I can justify continuing in this beadmaking 'hobby' for the last 8 years is that sales far exceed expenses. Otherwise it is an expensive hobby that will eventually lead to you selling your equipment unless you have a lot of disposable income.

Sorry to be the wet blanket, but I've seen it happen over and over again.

Oh, and staying away from expensive silver glass and dichro will not necessarily end up being a cost saver because that is what customers want.
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Old 2011-04-13, 9:08am
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Hmmm... Not sure it's a hobby if you're selling...

Here's another thread about inexpensive tools:
http://www.lampworketc.com/forums/sh...ad.php?t=86940
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Old 2011-04-13, 10:23am
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I think almost all hobbies are expensive.
I covered my work area with cement backer board and then placed very large tiles on top. It works great and was cheap.
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Old 2011-04-15, 1:52pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Conrad Hoffman View Post
Glass work of any type isn't a cheap hobby so I though it might be useful to get some ideas for how to get involved without breaking the bank. A Hot Head is certainly a good place to start. I'll add cheap pliers and mashers from Harbor Freight that have been mentioned in other threads. How about "found glass"? Worth playing with? I use a steel cookie tray for bench protection and an old piece of sheet metal for protection on the far side of the bench. No reason not to mash your own frits. How else to save some bucks?
Conrad, what do you buy at Harbor Freight that acts as mashers? I'd love to find these.
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Old 2011-04-15, 3:19pm
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I've been selling all my other "hobby" parts on Ebay to generate enough to start this one! But somehow deep down I KNOW this is what I want to stick with for a really long time, so I do what I have to do--buy shorts, old tools, a used torch. Right now I'm on this lovable timesucking forum (I start in one room and end up on the full neighborhood tour... looking for information on reg's and arrestors before I maybe go spend at the welding shop...
Enjoy it for what it is, and understand the anticipation of collecting all the parts is part of the fun!! My anticipation to use the kiln I got at my local Gem & Mineral society is bursting out of me--but I can't even start until I have my safety issues covered. I totally agree with Jaci about safety first--and then fun!

And the public library has been a godsend for info--without buying books that are kind of worthless (they're out there!!). Many of the staff know me and the books I've been checking out by now, and are thrilled to see them with all the pretty covers and beads. I'm thrilled to read and learn, pick and choose, gather ideas and designs, and figure out which books really deserve and should be in my 'reference' library. Hope this helps!
Now back to my original purpose....what was it again??!! Oh yeah, regs and arrestors.....ah yes another chunk of change........YES I AM part of the economic recovery!
Smiles, Sheri
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  #28  
Old 2011-04-15, 5:43pm
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How do you make it a cheap hobby?

Stop and ask yourself ... do I need it, or do I just want it?
(this is true in almost every hobby!)

With lampworking, there are a few 'needs' .. a torch (w/hoses, regulators, etc.), safety glasses, a safe work place (ie: fireproof, ventilation, lighting, etc), and some 'basic' tools. Then, there are the consumables: gas, oxygen (if you're not on a HotHead), and glass.

Everything else is basically a 'want'. Yes, this includes a kiln ... you only *need* a kiln if you *want* to save/sell your work.

So, if you keep you 'needs' simple, and your 'wants' under control, it's not hard to keep your costs down.

Glass: using recycled glass is false economy. There's plenty of inexpensive glass out there (there's also a lot of EXPENSIVE glass out there ... but that's a 'want', not a 'need').

Oxygen: if you can afford an oxycon, and have a small torch that will run on one, this can save you a lot of money. Plus, you don't need to buy an oxygen regulator. Otherwise, make friends with someone at your welding company.

Gas: if you have Natural Gas at your home, and your torch will run on it, this also can save you some money. Plus, you won't need to buy a gas regulator. Otherwise, a BBQ tank of propane will last a long time on most small torches.

Most everything else can be scrounged.

If this is a hobby, keep it fun and keep it simple. If you want it to pay for itself, or to turn it into a business, that's another story.

Malcolm
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  #29  
Old 2011-04-15, 5:59pm
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Conrad Hoffman Conrad Hoffman is offline
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I need to get over to Harbor Freight and see what they have right now- haven't been there in a year or so. I'll use any cheap pliers and modify them as needed, but I probably do smaller and odder things than artistic workers. I know there are some parallel jaw pliers (usually with a cutter sticking off one side) that would be handy, but I don't know if Harbor has 'em.

As for the hobby aspect, I have near zero separation of my work and hobbies. My guess is that doesn't work well for most people, and nothing will destroy the enjoyment of many hobbies quicker than turning them into a business. A business needs to be a business first if it's going to be competent and do well. Well, my opinion anyway.
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Old 2011-04-16, 8:45am
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rainygrrl rainygrrl is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArtcoInc View Post
Stop and ask yourself ... do I need it, or do I just want it?
(this is true in almost every hobby!)
Malcolm
This is a good thing to consider in other aspects of life as well!
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