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  #61  
Old 2010-01-15, 4:34pm
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Are you saying, Acidfly, that the tutorials that are "well not that good" weren't done in a way that was understandable by you, or that you already knew the information, or that the information wasn't presented in a way that was best for your learning style? Were the tutorials too advanced for you or not advanced enough?

Unfortunately in such a small community I would be concerned that personalities might play a part in the review someone would give a tutorial.
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  #62  
Old 2010-01-16, 6:43am
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Well at over 12 thousand LE members I would not say that its a small community and I don't know any of you really so personalities really have nothing to do with me anyways. I am not going to get into details here, Price = knowledge not equal, skipped steps because they think people already know that step, pictures that you cant see whats going on, like alot of things around here the knowledge is out for free but because of being new taken advantage of because not knowing its out there for free, etc.
Stuff like that, sometimes a 5 min video would show it better and well video camera's don't cost very much now a days or even a web cam video would have been a better choice.
Don't get me wrong I have got a couple they were awesome and anything I ask the author trys to answer Its just sometimes at that price I shouldn't have to ask "sometimes I'm slow in the head but not often" lol maybe more info on the level of the tut so new people can have a feel of were the tuts going to take them. BIG thing putting a list of supplies needed to do the tut as I have not even done 1 or 2 because I didn't want to spend another 50 bucks just to try it.

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Last edited by AcidFly; 2010-01-16 at 6:59am.
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  #63  
Old 2010-01-16, 7:52am
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AcidFly has a point. As a rabid fan of tutorials, both purchased and free, I have to say that (like most anything else) they are not created equal. The vast majority are awesome, superbly done and well written/photographed. Some, well....eh...not so much - but fortunately these are rare. An experienced lampworker usually has a pretty good idea of what is going to be required to work the tutorial before purchasing - but an inexperienced one may not and the suggestion of materials required up front is a good one as well as an honest assessment of the skill level required for the technique. As far as cost to the lampworker goes, I am always willing to pay a little more to compensate an expert who is taking their precious time away from their craft to educate me.
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  #64  
Old 2010-01-16, 8:15am
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Okay, so now I know where you are coming from. So you felt you paid more for the knowledge than it was worth. The author skipped steps that you personally would need in order to understand what they are doing. The photography does not portray the step in a way that is discernable by you. And your final complaint is that the knowledge is out there for free and you feel as if you have been taken advantage of because you elected to buy this tutorial.

Thank you for answering. Oh, did you happen to contact the author to tell them your criticisms of their tutorial and ask for a refund? And if so, did they refuse to refund your payment?
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  #65  
Old 2010-01-16, 9:37am
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I don't always type what I ment to say but yes you are getting my point I am not saying that its not my fault as it is. No i have never went back to complain or anything, I just put it down as a learning lesson. There is alot of work people do to put these out I know this. Also me not researching the style better before I buy "my fault again" IDK it just seems to be the mood here is to help the new guy as long as you got alot of money to pay for it "but that's how it is with most things"
I don't sell stuff "not there yet" and probably wont. The internet is already swamped with lampwork so not much room for someone to step in "market already saturated" so This is a plain hobby for me. I never thought i was going to make a living at this or even sell anything, So basically to pay for a 20 dollar tut and not be able to get results "either to much a noob or just play cant afford the glass, etc or just don't understand the style.
I guess is more my problem as I think more on the subject. I'm not here to make money just to have some fun and make some cool stuff. So I'm probably on a different level then most as well if it takes 5 mins to tell or show me something Please don't charge me 20 bucks as its just for fun not a investment. I probably will get board with lampwork in a couple years just like well Casting, Building R/C plains, Hot rod cars, etc.
thanks for your time and knowledge but when it gets to expensive or non fun then this hobby will be over for me. If i meant to make a living or something I don't think i would be buying tut off a chat room, I would have just went to school and payed the big bucks.
I also think some of the authors should think about live web cam stuff, I would feel much better if i could see someone do it live then read it from a paper as I can ask quick questions or even see there mistakes as its being done. I would have not problem paying for this kind of thing and would probably feel better and get more out of it this way
So if you understand my rambling lol that's about all i got to say about the subject.
AcidFly

Last edited by AcidFly; 2010-01-16 at 9:52am.
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  #66  
Old 2010-01-16, 10:05am
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Thanks, Acidfly, I do understand where you are coming from. As a lampworker who never meant to make a living from the glass I create, I certainly understand, but I do think that if you purchase a tutorial that doesn't work for you for whatever reason, a quick email to the author would probably be beneficial to everyone. You get to express your dissatisfaction with the tutorial, the author gets to learn what can be improved on and the other tutorial buyers will benefit from a possibly improved tutorial.

One of the few classes I have taken was with a person who was very, very good at lampworking, so good that inadvertantly this person left out steps that she thought everyone would understand without being told, or steps that she instinctively knew and just never thought of including as instruction. This was a first class for her, and I did experience her class again and found that she had improved greatly from the first class. Sometimes it is all about having someone point something out to you, as the author, that is obvious to the purchaser, but not so much to someone very familiar with the subject. Good luck to you and I hope you enjoy your lampworking.
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  #67  
Old 2010-01-16, 10:16am
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Goethe would be proud....
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  #68  
Old 2010-01-16, 10:22am
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lol I had to look up who Goethe was lmao

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  #69  
Old 2010-01-16, 10:25am
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As a consumer, I won't spend what a lot of people are selling tutorials for. I prefer books hands down. I don't want to have to print things out myself then bind them and have them in a measley binder. I think tutorials are just that, tutorials. They should not be priced the same that you would buy a book for. With a book, you get a lot more for your money.. pretty, vibrant, pictures, glossy pages, etc. I think I have bought one, maybe two tutorials and I have yet to use them. I have a few books and love them to pieces. I can take them anywhere with me. I understand that as an author, it is hard to get a book to get published but I would feel, if it were me, I would feel so much more rewarded. There are those that are out to make money. There are those that are out to be recognized and love what they do. It all depends on what your priorities are. If price is the determining factor, maybe a few artists should get together and publish something together. I know though, that some artists are so good, they can stand on their own and will definitely make their money back and do very well if they take the time to go forth and just do it.

Just my opinion, take it for what its worth.
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  #70  
Old 2010-01-16, 11:14am
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I think that the market will determine what the authors of these tutorials do. As long as there are large enough numbers of those that would rather have the fresh information as opposed to a delayed published book, then the authors have no need to put any more time and effort into what they are now doing. I think books have a place and tutorials have a place. Many lampworkers don't want to spend the amount of time away from their torch to supply the information necessary to create a whole book, or are able to invest the amount of money necessary to fund that book. I also think that there is another reason tutorial writers put the effort into creating these tutorials, to share their knowledge with the lampworking community. I honestly don't think the majority do it for the money, although some undoubtedly do. I think they want to give back to the community with the knowledge they have accumulated over the years. Do they want to lose money? No, of course not. Who does in this day and age? But I think the guiding force is to share their knowledge. I would bet if you calculated the hours authors spend in developing their tutorials and the amount of money they make from them, they could have made more money in their studio making beads and selling them.
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  #71  
Old 2010-01-20, 3:26am
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I've noticed tutorial prices creeping up as well but as a tutorial writer I understand to a point. As Mary mentioned, what I am in effect giving, are my secrets. I will not give them away for nothing.
Authors who are living in other countries have the added disadvantage that we sell in dollars but, as in my case, I live in euros. This means that I make much less than you might think.
I charge $18.00 for my goddess tutorial. After fees and currency conversion, I make the equivalent of $12. For my toad tutorial which is listed at $25.00 I actually make $16.00. This is the reason that I increased my fee for the toad tutorial. I wasn't happy that I had to do it, but it was necessary in order to actually make a bit of income.
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  #72  
Old 2010-02-04, 11:49am
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Ok, personally I prefer books, I can touch them, carry them with me, smell them and see the scars on them that show that they are well loved. I also love knowledge and collect every scrap of it that I can on the subjects that interest me. The internet is amazing! As for tutorials, well, firstly I'm tight fisted so don't spend money easily, and tend not to buy them as they don't represent good value for me personally. I've just received Mary Moths 20c Bleeding Heart tutorial though, and I have to say that simply for the gesture she made with this, I would have happily paid $20 just because she has shown how sweet and kind she is.

Now, I say I'm tight fisted (I am, ask anyone who knows me) but the lack of value isn't my main problem with tutorials. I understand that people have to make a living, and I applaud enterprising ways of doing so. What I don't like, is the change its brought about in the lampworking community. Once of a day, people would share techniques readily, and for free via tutorials on websites or in threads on the forums - even sometimes free PDF's or Word documents. Now, many of those free tutorials have disappeared from the web, deleted from forums, and been re-packaged as `e-books' - I know this is true as I have several examples on my PC. Yes, the new e-tuts probably have better pics and clearer instructions, maybe even a new twisty recipe, but they are basically the same thing. It just makes me sad that what was once a very sharing community has become so strongly motivated by cold hard cash, and techniques are no longer shared amongst online friends - they are sold to customers...

Maybe I'm just an old hippy at heart, but still it makes me sad.

I have to acknowledge that there are some lovely people who simply give their techniques and advice freely. There is the fibula tut, spinning top, and the dolls eyes techniques (among others) that are all recent and appreciated offerings, but a little bit of something special has left the community I feel....

Just personal opinion, not aimed at anyone - no offence meant, so please don't take it
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