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  #91  
Old 2008-01-03, 6:51pm
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I use Powder Pink and Rubino...makes a nice dusty rose color.

Of course my flowers look nowhere near as fine and lustrous.
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  #92  
Old 2008-01-03, 8:47pm
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Anyone need some spacers?
 
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I have had the same problem with CIM Sangre. I have worked cool and never over heated to get the best results. I made some spacers and the center was red but the outer area was a golden color. Not a bad color but not what I expected.
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  #93  
Old 2008-01-03, 8:52pm
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I am trying so hard at flower beads and every time something smears or I get an hour into it and my darn bead is so huge that my little ole hot head just can't melt it all in anymore. I get so frustrated!!! How do you get the layered look without so many clear layers? Theirs got to be an easier trick right? Gosh I hope so.
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  #94  
Old 2008-01-03, 8:57pm
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[quote=sarbeardog;1563747]

I want to try something like this but what I want to know is are you putting the base color then clear then vine or base and then vine then clear then petals? Like I said before after putting so many layers of clear the bead is so wonking huge my hot head doesnt melt it anymore. I would love any help.
Thanks, Corey
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  #95  
Old 2008-01-03, 9:25pm
sarbeardog sarbeardog is offline
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Corey,

I put the base color, vine, encase with clear, more vine then start the layers of dot.

If you look at Cynthia's post #69 That explains how I did this bead pretty much.
It sounds like you need to make sure that you start very small cause it grows. The dots are small. Again they grow also. I also do several layers of dots.
So give it a try and post your pictures
I will be more the happy to answer any question.
Kathy
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  #96  
Old 2008-01-03, 9:48pm
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Corey you can also put down your base color. Make it thin, marver it flat. Then put on your vine without doing a layer of clear. You need a layer of clear on top of the vine, then start your petals. You do not need to encase each layer of petals. Just add clear on the petals.

I hope that helps.
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  #97  
Old 2008-01-03, 11:04pm
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Hi Corey~

As you know, I'm on a Hot Head, too. Be sure to check Michelle's Post #67 for a link to a fab tutorial - there she shows us the amazing secret, pics. included, on how to simply cover the petals with clear, which will save us HH'ers the pain and HUGENESS of complete encasement. Also, H Headers, here's a few tips I've found invaluable:

1. Make sure you switch to a brand new cannister of MAPP (if this is what you use with your HH) before embarking on one of these beads to avoid disappointment when the dang thing runs out of gas just before your finished!!! (I HATE when that happens!)

2. If you do not have a kiln to place these in as soon as you are finished, you can give your bead a great chance of survival by getting a small crock pot, filling it with vermiculite (hard to find at the local hardware store anymore; check your local pet store in the reptile section. I bought several bags as I understand this material is now under new "regulations" and will become harder and harder to find.) After filling with the vermiculite, turn the crock pot on and let it get HOT at least 15 minutes before you start. This gets all the vermiculite nice and toasty. When you have completed your bead and flame annealed, place the finished bead into the vermiculite, making sure it's snuggled down deeply into it, and when your session is done, turn the crock pot off and unplug it. Let it cool down over night before removing the bead to batch anneal.

3. Flame anneal a good, long time after you complete your bead. Just bathe it in the back of the flame for at least 2 minutes. This seems to help set everything nicely and evenly heats the bead to a fairly cool temp. before putting it into the kiln or crock pot.

Hope this helps you.
DeAnne in CA
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  #98  
Old 2008-01-05, 4:23am
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Michelle is the first person that made me want to make encased floral beads

The way I make my florals basically the same with others.

I make the small barrel bead, add vines and encase it in clear.

The only different is instead of melting the dots all the way flat, I only melt it half way. Sometimes I add another opaque/pastel colors before I add the transparent/clear. I melt this new color half way as well. Then I add transparent/clear roughly the same size like the base dots and melt it flat.

Repeat this if you want to make multi layers flowers.

NOTE : I don't encase the whole bead so my bead. At this stage, my bead never round. Mostly they are in triangle or square shapes. It's too hard for me on HH to melt big blop of clear and keep this blop hot and runny.

After final layer of petals, I take the bead out of the flame a bit until the red glow disappeared, then spot heat the middle of flower and plunge. I'll do this on every single flowers before covering them with clear.

Since I'm on HH with bulk propane and HH melt the glass slower than any other torch, I encase the bead a little bit different with dual torch user.

First, I add clear on every single plunged holes.

Then, I spot encase every single petals. I always try to overlap the clear or the colors underneath will bleed. Don't forget to keep the bead warm by do 1 - 2 rotations in flame.

After I add the clear on every single flowers, then I start spot encase the gaps between the flowers.

Melt all these dots flat.

I turn the bead so the mandrel is facing me. I then check if my bead round or not. If some area not exactly round, I add some clear dots only on that spot. Melt it flat again.

I do this step until I'm happy with the final shape of my bead.
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Last edited by gubnavnania; 2008-01-05 at 2:07pm. Reason: Some weird thing happened, my post did double post in 1 post... confused? so do I ;)
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  #99  
Old 2008-01-05, 4:29am
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Forgot to add, I mostly working on Bullseye when making encased floral beads. So a 10mm x 12mm double layers petals bead can takes up to 45 min with only a white, 1 color pastel and 1 transparent/clear for petal.

And I usually use a 1mm stringers for dots.
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  #100  
Old 2008-01-05, 9:53am
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Thank you Yunita,

Last night I made a couple of beads and I had melted the dots flats after each layer.
Then I heated the bead cooled then plunged. The flowers came out flat.
I'll go back to stacking the dots I guess would be the best way to describe the layering.
It so difficult to explain this process. And I"m not the best writer. I so admire Michelle, Cynthia, DeAnne and You who are able to put this process in words! I'm going to keep trying.
Kathy
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  #101  
Old 2008-01-05, 10:59am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sarbeardog View Post
Thank you Yunita,

Last night I made a couple of beads and I had melted the dots flats after each layer.
Then I heated the bead cooled then plunged. The flowers came out flat.
I'll go back to stacking the dots I guess would be the best way to describe the layering.
It so difficult to explain this process. And I"m not the best writer. I so admire Michelle, Cynthia, DeAnne and You who are able to put this process in words! I'm going to keep trying.
Kathy
You can add another clear dot on the top of transparent or clear to give more depth.
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  #102  
Old 2008-01-30, 8:29pm
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I am so inspired by all who have chosen to share I have been practicing florals since I could make a decent round bead and due to the fact that I am completetly self taught I now know where all of my mistakes are and how to fix them. Here is a before pic of my flowers and when I can get some torch time in I will post the afters using the amazing tut. Thank you to all
Michelle
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  #103  
Old 2008-01-30, 8:55pm
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Great Job Michelle!
I really look forward to see your work in the near future. Its taken me lots of torch time to get were I'm at now with my florals.
The first part of May I'm taking a floral class from Starleen. Her website is
www.starleensstudio.com. She does some of the most beautiful florals
Enjoy your time on the torch learning the florals!

Yunita, thanks for responding back. I'm sorry I didn't write back.
Been working on those florals. It so funny I haven't been able to repeat what I did with the bead I posted(the blue one) I did try and add clear to the top of the dots, then punge to create more of a cup look. It didn't come out the best but I'm going to keep trying. So look forward to the floral class I'm taking in May.

Kathy
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  #104  
Old 2008-01-31, 8:05am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theglasszone View Post
Heather/Donna: So far, I've had really good luck with using a Crock Pot with well heated vermeculite to hold my formed beads until I'm done with a session and then I unplug the Pot, and allow it to slowly cool down over night before I remove the beads from their mandrels. Unfortunately, I have very limited space, limited funds, and a rather sparse and unsophisticated set up for now; I have a PMC kiln that has a cycle that I can program to anneal my beads, so batch annealing is my only option right now. I'd love to get my hands on a used Chili Pepper (know where I can find one?), but for now, this is my only hope. Lots of finger crossing and so on....luck's been on my side!

Thanks again to everyone for all the great information, encouragement and photos! If I have success, I'll be sure to post!

DeAnne in CA

If you have a program you can anneal them as you make them. I use the Paragon PMC kiln and I just bought a bead door fo rit. Works great!
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  #105  
Old 2008-01-31, 10:00am
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Keep up the great work Michelle!
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  #106  
Old 2008-02-11, 1:44pm
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I am still having trouble with one thing- I did not have time to read all the posts so forgive me if this has been covered but I cannot get purple to behave itself. I would love to use this new info I have given with my fav color but no matter what type of glass I use purple just doesn't seem to like to be encased it feathers and I loose all definition on the petals and it looks smeared Please help I so excited that I can finally make a decent floral bead but very frustrated that I can't use the pretty colors any info on fushia pinks would be good too. Thank you in advance
Michelle
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  #107  
Old 2008-02-11, 2:32pm
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Hi Michelle,
Try putting another colour dot down before the purple one so there is a thin line containing the purple. I do that when I make red flower beads as the red is also inclined to spread.
Kerry
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  #108  
Old 2008-02-11, 5:17pm
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Thank you so much!!! do you have a preference as to which base color you use? Thank you again for responding I will post pics soon (hubby has the camera).
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  #109  
Old 2008-02-11, 6:05pm
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Michelle, it depends on the look you are after but I use mostly periwinkle, coral, opal yellow, copper green, black or one of the dark violets. I don’t know the number of the dark violet, I bought it some time ago. It doesn’t have to be a darker color, just a thin line to stop the other color from spreading.
Kerry
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  #110  
Old 2008-02-11, 9:17pm
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Kerry do you sell your work or have an online gallery? I would really enjoy seeing some more of your beads. Your florals are stunning!
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  #111  
Old 2008-02-11, 11:26pm
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Hi Janelle, thank you for the kind words.
Yes I do sell my beads but I don't have an online gallery. Once a month I have a stall at a small local craft market. Most of the time I don't even get to take pictures..
I do make other beads besides florals. At the moment I'm having fun making what I call "Treasure Beads" but that's another thread....
Kerry
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  #112  
Old 2008-02-13, 7:07am
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What a treat to read through this and get inspired to try florals again! Thanks so much for all the wonderful advice. Makes 10 inches of new snow with rain on top seem not so bad afterall.

Sals
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  #113  
Old 2008-02-18, 11:40am
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sarbeardog-your blue floral is outstanding!!! Sorry, it's taken so long to get back to this thread....I was away for a good part of January and part of Feb.

I still have 2 pages to read yet!

Way to go everyone!!!
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  #114  
Old 2008-06-10, 11:11pm
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Just wanted to tell all of you that I tried this tonight. I made the best flowers that I've ever made!!! Considering how mine usually look that's saying a lot. LOL!

The petals actually had some depth. I say that in past tense because when I encased it, it got all wonky (big globs of clear in some places) and I don't know if I lost it all, trying to reshape it with heat.

One question? Is is OK to marver it after the final encasing or will it smear and distort the flowers? I was too afraid to try it.

Thanks to everyone who put together all the tips, and the list, (I really needed that.) In fact I copied, cut and pasted to make a new list, from the old list and the extra tips.

Then I used another tutorial that someone posted years ago by Kim Fields. Got all side tracked making an encased cane for stamen.

Vine or Stamen Cane: Use a base of Nile Green, encase with clear, (I forgot that part) then linear stripe encase with clear, and black. Go back and stripe it again with black over the clear stripes and clear over the black stripes.

I used the cane for vines, with a black base bead, added Powder Pink dots, flattened, then Ruby Ore on top. Indented the petals, and plunged the centers.

I flattened the petals after I put on the clear dots cause I figured it would push the clear down and make more of a cup shape. Is that the correct way to do it? I even remembered to "ruffle" the edges.

The problem is my encasing. I had a nice sized bead before I encased the final bead. Then it got huge with very un-even casing.

This is a real problem for me. Maybe I should use stringer but the clear glass is all c*** and seems to get worse when pulled. Maybe I should flatten the gather into a lollypop?

I did notice when I angled my clear gather 45 degrees at the start to get more of the gather on the front of the bead, pushing pretty hard, and quickly put the rod perpindicular to the bead while turning it, it was thinner, and was much wider, covering more of the bead at once, FWIW.
Now if I could only do that every time!

ANYWAY, my big floral bead is in the kiln!!! Can't wait to see it in the morning. It's fun to have something to look forward to first thing.

Sorry for the very long winded thanks to all. It's been awhile since I've seen improvement in my beads and this may finally be one of those times when I feel a little encouraged.

Wave,
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  #115  
Old 2008-06-11, 9:24am
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Originally Posted by theglasszone View Post
Heather!!! Thank you so much for your clarification - and the picture of the "other" Orchid Bead you made - just as lovely, stunning and inspirational as the first!

Thanks so much to everyone for posting in the thread!!!! I spent about an hour last night (in our wimpy CA "chill", which was still quite cold for 'lil 'ol ME!) pulling cane and stamen stringers - I have to pull some additional striped canes to try and work for petals, I think maybe I'll need thicker ones than what I've made.

Hey, Vikki - any photos for us yet???

What a wonderful help this has been...I'm thinking that what I've written in the layout below might be the basic general reference steps to making a multi-layered floral bead, so if I'm "off" here or anyone has something to add, please speak up!!!!

BASIC STEPS FOR MAKING FLORAL ENCASED BEAD:

1. Wind base bead (dark seems to really make the bead in final form "pop").
2. Add "frit" or other, neutral decoration.
3. Encase in clear.
4. Add "vine" cane in twisted, random fashion.
5. Encase again in clear.
6. Add first "set" of lower-most petals, using "opaque" color; shape, crease, or pull out the tips for longer, thinner petals. Methods, depending on the type of flower being made, might be "dot", "stripe" or combination of the two. Add transparent color over opaque and melt in (not applicable in the case of the "striped cane" long, thin petals).
7. Encase again in clear.
8. Continue adding layers of petals, using appropriate method in step #6 above (dot, stripe or both), and encase in clear between each layer.
9. Add final petals (or in case of "daffodil" or "orchid", final "cup" or "beard", as I believe is called in the last, uppermost petal in the orchid. This would be the "dot" method, with some delicate "ruffles" possibly added with shaper method of choice, using either a pick or stringer).
10. Encase again in a final layer of clear.
11. Spot heat the center of the flower and use the stamen cane, clear stringer or tungsten pick to "plunge" into the center of the uppermost petal or center of the final cluster of petals.
12. Add a small "cap" of clear - atop the nipped stamen or over the plunged "hole" in the case of the petal cluster or orchid "beard".
13. Flame anneal and pop into kiln or crock pot with vermeculite.

How's this sound? Feedback please!!!

Thanks again to everybody!
DeAnne in CA
I must be very challenged. If I did this my bead would be 3 inches in diameter.
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  #116  
Old 2008-06-11, 11:36pm
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That's why I skipped encasing until I got to the end.
Though I will try encasing #3 also, cause that one can be over a SUPER small barrel. Just big enough to be the very center of the bead.
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  #117  
Old 2008-06-17, 8:35pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theglasszone View Post
Hi There!

I agree - the beads that have been posted so far are really awesome, aren't they!!! I'm still in the "practice" and "trial and error" stages, so no pictures from me - yet!!!

Beadgal - I can give you the benefit of my experiments, at least..."spot" encasing seems to complicate the design by causing the "spot" encased areas to want to spread while rounding up the whole bead; encasing the entire bead seems to help the base design "hold" it's configuration, design and shape. With this in mind, I can suggest two things: First, using clear STRINGER to do the encasing helps to keep it thinner that using clear ROD, thus keeping the overall finished size of your bead smaller. Second, regarding encasing, make sure you check the link to Mary Lockwood's encasing tutorial in Wendy's Post #6 above. In it, you'll notice she is using clear ROD in the example, but the STRINGER works just as well if not better - for me, at least! I'm on a Hot Head, so I definitely don't work too big (I'm a "smaller bead" person anyway, and definitely don't want to deal with the "heat" issues caused by using a Hot Head and MAPP with a huge-o bead...crackville!) So far I've had no problems, and the largest bead I've made so far, even with 3 layers of encasing, ended up less than 3/4" across.

One last thing, if you start with a "core" base of color/frit/decoration such as you see in Heather's beautiful Orchid bead, if you intend to end up with a smaller bead, make sure it's a very thin core base and it seems to help by rolling it on a marver to keep it thin before the first clear encasing. Don't worry too much if it's really super thin since you'll be adding layer upon layer atop it. At least that's what I've found so far...

DeAnne in CAt

DeAnne in CA
This sounds like a great way to keep your encased bead small!
How big are the stringers you pull for stringer encasing? (millimeters)
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  #118  
Old 2010-01-21, 12:41am
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...18 months later - RESURRECTION! (And I'm STILL struggling with florals!!!)

I've just gone through and slowly and carefully re-read this entire thread. Couple things are for sure:

* My "tutorial" of sorts posted early in this thread has some serious flaws - mostly with putting FULL Clear Encasing between each set of petals. Obviously that's gonna make a gigantic bead; the suggestion to put thin "spot encasings" of clear over the first set, second set, etc. of petals seems to be a WAY BETTER IDEA!

* A lentil shaper seems to be the way to go! Argh...I've owned and sold two - I'm off to beg in Garage Sale and see if anyone has one collecting dust!

* Cynthia's suggestion (in addition to using the lentil shaper) to bring the transparent, secondary dot (over your first opaque dot) ALL THE WAY TO THE EDGE looks like an oversight I'm going to have to pay more attention to!

* I've seen more than one person mention making the petal dots using a "1mm cane". Is this for real? That sounds very, very small - but it could be a huge clue as to why I just can do these correctly.

* I may never get over the gorgeousness of Heather's Orchid! I even occasionally dream of that bead (both of them actually).

* I'm determined to get this right!

I thought it might be fun to bring this thread up to the top again. Gemsinbloom has a Florals/Encasing thread going, and I remembered this one and all the good advice here! Would love to keep both going simultaneously if possible!

In the last 18 months, I've become a murrini-making fool! I've even made rose cane to feed my floral need, but I'm finding I just yearn for the true, dot-applied florals as are shown here. Maybe this year will be the year I DO IT!

Pray for me...


De
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  #119  
Old 2010-01-21, 10:50pm
sarbeardog sarbeardog is offline
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Thanks Deanne for bringing this forward to go along with gemsinbloom thread.
Can't wait to get out to the studio and try again with the florals. Been trying for 4 years now. I keep hoping for a miracle with my florals! I just know know its going to happen!
Kathy
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  #120  
Old 2010-01-21, 11:37pm
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gemsinbloom gemsinbloom is offline
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I have to sleep now so I will read this whole thread tomorrow but a quick note.......I use 2mm stringers of opaque and full rods for the traspRent dots. Always have, always will but I make larger vocals and I like big juicy flowers in my beads

remember everyone has their own ways and prefrences and to not get so stuck with rules and techniques. Yes there are basics you need to undrstand and follow for success. Once I understood the basics of a successful floral, dimpled ends , rounded petas, etc etc, then it all came together for me. I love all the tutorials I purchased and over the years I have bought every floral tutorial out there, always hoping something would click. If just one tutorial author had stated thw why's of a few details, I would of gotten in a lot sooner.

That being said, if I do write tutorials in the future, the why's will always be included. This is how I learn and I suspect many others do as well,
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