Starting in Scientific Glassblowing

[RyanTheNumberImp]

I have become interested in scientific glassblowing for some of my hobbies and was wondering what type of glass to get. My math puts the asian tubing at about half the price as simax but it is a bit of a pain to do the conversion back and forth between $/lb and $/piece/case.

Is there any major difference between the two? Roughly how much of each size do you think is reasonable to get? I was thinking 3lb of every diameter/wall thickness up to 25mm to start, but it is cheap enough that I might get more of the smaller diameters to practice with.

All of my pricing has been taken from abr, I'm not sure what other places sell tubing.

Finally, I live in Canada and shipping looks to approximately double the cost of the glass (Even so, 4$/lb isn't too bad). Is there any place that sells boro tubing in Canada?

[rg9403]

I recommend a lot more research before you purchase anything. First, the size of the tubes you use depends on what your trying to make. Next, the asian tubing sucks. If your going to be making blown vessels you need better quality glass to improve your chances of uniform thickness and eveness.

Try compareing prices more at these places:

Mountain Glass Arts
Generations Glass
Winship Designs
National Scientific (Quartz.com)

[RyanTheNumberImp]

Thanks, I'm going to go through the library later this week, I remember reading a book on scientific glassblowing a long time ago but never had the tubing to do it.

I'm going to be making a wide variety of things but I am going to keep my work small since I don't have a huge kiln or torch. And of course, since I have some northstar/GA I'm not going to be able to resist the temptation of trying some beads/whatever else you can make with tubing.

National Scientific looks like it has the best selection of pyrex (I am probably going to need some of the <5mm tubing) and decent prices; any idea how their shipping is? I am still thinking that the best option would be to pick up a few pieces of most of the smaller diameters, getting more of the stuff closer to 10mm since that seems to be recommended for practicing. What diameters are most useful for making inside out beads?

[chayes]

This may help http://www.ecu.edu/glassblowing/gb.htm

[Ashmo]

I have ordered a lot of my clear from Pegasus glass out of Ontario. I use Simax but they do have Pyrex as well. The guy that taught me was a scientific glassblower in Ontario. He worked for a small scientific glass shop, maybe there is a place in Calgary as well? They may be able to sell you some glass in smaller quantities?

[RyanTheNumberImp]

Thanks, looking for a scientific glass shop is a great idea; I'll check the yellow pages.

What kind of tubing would you suggest someone to start out with to learn? I'm probably going to burn through a few pounds of ~12mm just pulling points and making test tubes and such.

[Hels]

Ryan, I haven't worked with the asian tubing, but I have worked with the rods, and the thermal cracking, devitrifying and long term workability between that and a high quality clear is HUGE.

While I have no expertise on Scientific Glass Blowing, I have one of the comprehensive old out of print book on it, so I'm familar with the techniques from reading. I would strongly suggest you look into it further, and for the purpose, even practice, I'd buy Pyrex, because the viscosity difference is real, even between clears. It might be easier/cheaper to start out with your joins working smaller rather than with cheaper glass.

If you can't find a scientific glass blowing book at your public library (which may help you decide which book to buy on ebay or a used book store), try Ebay, half bay, Alibris or just search for titles and then search that title to see if anyone's selling it currently.

I think for Scientific Glass, classes at a glass blowing campus may be the best way to go if you find you want to do it... I saw a lot of jobs for that too, and with your aptitude, you'll do really well.

Here's a few books you can search for used (Ebay has a couple of them cheaper right now):
http://www.amazon.com/SCIENTIFIC-GLA...0897276&sr=8-1

http://www.amazon.com/Creative-Glass...0897276&sr=8-2
(this is the one I have... it's good, lots of illustrations)

The rest are more expensive (well the above book is $106 new, but used is as cheap as $12), so I'd start with these 2, the one I have has reviews as well and is considered one of the 'bibles' of scientific glass blowing.

[RyanTheNumberImp]

Thanks for the advice. I picked up "Glassblowing, An introduction to artistic and scientific flameworking" as well as "Glassblowing for laboratory technicians" which both seem to cover the entire range of techniques and have some step by step guides to some condensers, funnels, traps etc.

The Calgary Public Library (I live in calgary) has a really awesome site where you can search books and put them on hold at the click of a button and they have both books you recommended so I'll be receiving those in a few days.

I can't find any place that does scientific glassblowing in Calgary but I remember a guy who worked making pipes a few years ago who might sell me some if he is still around. Otherwise I will compare the pricing for pegasusglass , cansci glass and quartz.com to see what is the best way to get tubing.

[rg9403]

keep in mid that Pyrex isn't top quality glass anymore. Corning used to make the glass...now i thnk it's made in Japan. Simax seems to be the best quality for the price IMO.

[RyanTheNumberImp]

I'm going to go with whatever I can reasonably get. Quartz.com sells pyrex by the tube at a pretty good price (from what I've seen). Cansci glass sells Kimax and is in Canada but seems to be about twice as expensive as quartz.com even after exchange.

I've sent an email to Pegasus (They have Simax) to see if they will sell to me by the rod.

[Hels]

Another thing to consider is to call someone who hires for scientific glass blowing (a lot of corporations have them on staff) and ask them what glass they use... odds are good that if this becomes a career for you, THAT will be the glass you will spend your life playing with, start now... and you may make a friend/mentor in the process.

[Janice]

Ryan, check at the universities as well. My father and my husband were/are in scientific research, and both have always had "their own" glass blowers for special stuff. (I mean, check their Science departments...ask them who they use, or if they have someone on staff)

J.

[Janice]

University of Alberta article:

http://www.expressnews.ualberta.ca/article.cfm?id=1217

J

[Janice]

Canadian Scientific Glassblowing:
http://www.cansciglass.com/

Our products range from simple, standard laboratory glassware (flasks, condensers, adapters, columns, etc.) to complex technical systems involving custom glass apparatus integrated with diverse laboratory hardware. Our glassblowers also provide general repair service for most types of cracked or broken glassware.

In addition to manufacturing and repairing specialty glassware we sell:

* a full line of borosilicate tubing and rod
* a wide range of new and used laboratory hardware - including heating mantles, controllers, vacuum systems, thermometers, hot plates, stirrers, chillers, support stands
* laboratory supplies - filter paper, rubber and polymer tubing, vacuum pump oil, and more

In our machine shop, we manufacture custom metal parts and products, and we provide repair and overhaul service for most types of mechanical vacuum pumps.

We are a family-run business and have provided quality work at a reasonable price for over 35 years.

Our clients include research and development laboratories in the biotechnology and environmental sector, optical and lighting industries, major government and university labs, and pharmaceutical, food and drug, pulp and paper, and wine industries. We also sell to other glassblowers, to the art glass community, and over-the-counter to the general public.

Here's a link to their product page: http://www.cansciglass.com/products.html Which includes "Glass Tubing and Rod

Canadian Scientific Glassblowing Ltd. is an authorized distributor of KIMBLE Kimax Brand *KG-33 borosilicate glass tubing and rod to the Canadian laboratory and technical industry. We stock most of the common tubing and rod sizes on our price list, and can normally ship to your company within a few business days. Click the titles below to view the catalogue and price list "

Hope this is helpful!!!

J.

[wickedglass]

My apprenticeship was in scientific glass, and I have to say that it's an expensive apprenticeship for whoever takes you on (you will need a master to work under). I don't know how much experience in glass you have, but you can't just pick up scientific glass from book learning. Scientific is the most difficult of glass disciplines to learn, bar none. Angles have to be spot-on, wound coils have to be even, diameters within extremely tight tolerances. For example, imagine joining a 3mm tube to the side of a 40 mm tube, imagine joining the same said tube at a 120.3 degree angle with a 0.05 degree tolerance ??? Will you love doing that kind of work? The name of the game here is perfection and extremely clean work! If that's you, then you're on the right track. The proper job designation is "Scientific Glass Instrument Maker".

You obviously don't have a teacher, otherwise you wouldn't be asking what kind of glass to use. Get yourself a teacher (master) first (or enter a school which teaches scientific work), then ask about glass. That's the first step. Then be prepared for years of learning. A proper course in scientific glassblowing (ie practical application under a master combined with trade school) will take you up to 7 years to become a master yourself.

Don't get me wrong, I don't want to discourage you at all, but only to make you aware that it's not some rinki-dink trade you can pick up from a book, it's a long (and very rewarding) road you're staring down.

Having said that, the best glass to use for scientific work is Schott Duran glass. It's clean and works more precise than corning (which seems to have gone down in quality over the years) Chinese glass is total crap, but ok to practice with. If you can pull a straight point from chinese glass, you can pull a point out of almost any glass. Another scientific grade glass is Schott AR glass, but I don't think you want to get into that, it's a kind of soda (soft) glass. Ilmenau glass is also comparable to Schott. Simax is very different in the way it works, it becomes a lot softer in the flame than Duran, but it's also suitable.
10mm - 12mm glass for practicing point pulling is perfect. Start yourself out on light wall tubing. It's cheaper, it's perfect for teaching you nuances in heat and if you can consistently pull straight points from lightwall, you can pull straight point out of any wall-thickness glass .... learning on medium or heavy wall and then going down to light wall is more difficult.
Speaking of nuances in heat, you will also need to get yourself a suitable scientific torch. I would not suggest getting a torch which is commonly sold for srt glass. Pre-mix is more accurate than surface mix, they run a cooler flame also. You don't need the kind of heat wich is used for colour application, or the range in oxydization/reduction that torches made by (for example) GTT and Nortel can provide. GTTs will give you a nice needle-point flame, but the flame is too long and not precise enough for a lot of smaller scientific work. The Jupiter link in my sig will take you to an image to a scientific torch, check it out. Herbert Arnold "Zenith" torches have been developed for scientific work and are great workhorses!

Hope some of that helps ...
finally I'm going to stress again that you should find someone to take you under their wing and teach you ...