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Tips, Techniques, and Questions -- Technical questions or tips

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  #1  
Old 2007-07-01, 6:39am
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Default Glass colors that spread to make other shapes besides dots

Hello,
How do you make dots smash up against one another when you heat them to form rectangles, triangles, etc? Not just dots on top of dots.

I know part of it is knowing how big to make your dots, but isn't it also knowing the colors that spread, and which ones sink so won't work, and what to use for the base bead or under the dots?
Any tips or pointing me in the right direction would really help.
I admit I have not searched yet. But I just wanted to get it out there and maybe get a jump start on my Sunday bead practice.
Thanks in advance,
Angela
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  #2  
Old 2007-07-01, 7:20am
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I'm clueless, nevermind
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Old 2007-07-01, 7:22am
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These are an opal yellow base, the side dots that turn into triangles and go all the way to touch are new violet and the center dots are rubino that turns an orangey color on opal yellow and the center dots are copper green. I love to make these! Lots of fun spreading and reactions going on.

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Old 2007-07-01, 7:56am
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Those are freakin' gorgeous, Rebecca!!!
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Old 2007-07-01, 8:02am
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Thanks!
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  #6  
Old 2007-07-01, 8:07am
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suzyQ, Did I not explain myself very well? I was afraid of that. Hm...

Rebecca: Yes! That's exactly what I meant and the kind of thing I'm looking for. I those!

Angela
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Old 2007-07-01, 9:39am
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Maybe I should call what I'm trying to do the Halo effect or Tile Beads?
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Old 2007-07-01, 10:05am
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Try Reichenbacg Dots on light opaque Moretti colors (not the "special"-line) or even better on opaque check Ornela glass (ivory, blues, greens, violet,...). I love the effects!

This one is Reichenbach goldbrown on Ornela ivory:



regards, Verena
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  #9  
Old 2007-07-01, 10:19am
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Argh! Verena those are beautiful! I did a seach and saw some more pictures using Reichenbach like this.

But I'm sticking with Effetre and Vetrofond for now, (that's all I have). And maybe a bit of vintage glass soon <?>
Thank you though. I'm learning from this.
Angela
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Old 2007-07-01, 10:21am
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I used to love making these types of beads! All you need to know are the “spreading” colors! Effetre Purple was my favorite. You can put an EDP dot down first and then add other coordinating colors on top like copper green opal yellow, etc. or you can put an dot EDP on top to spread the colors out. There are other “spreaders” too besides EDP. Some other spreaders are Lauscha opaque purple, Lauscha opaque olive green, Effetre opaque mosaic green, and possibly others that I’m not thinking of right now. Also, many (maybe even most!) of the furnace glasses are spreaders and you can often buy them as lampworking cane and then pull them out into stringer and use just a dot or so on your coe 104 beads. The possibilities are endless when you combine the two.

I just love playing around with this type of effect. Here are some basic combinations I used (all Effetre). The picture is too big to post here, so here’s a link to it: http://users.zoominternet.net/~beadg...ce_effects.jpg

Candy
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  #11  
Old 2007-07-01, 10:38am
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Hey Candy, Oh my Gosh! I just looked at your link. I just love those colors. I have my work cut out for me now.
And thanks for listing the colors you used. That will really help me get a big start on this.
I knew that Effetre greens, even the regular ones spread like crazy. But that was the extent of my "list'. LOL!
I'm so worried about compatability so I stick with Effetre and Vetro for now.
But if all it takes is just a dot of say Funance glass then I would feel fine about using them.
I drooled over your frits BTW. But I'm waiting until I forget how much I just spent on glass to buy any, and some vintage glass from Pheonix, to use them with.
So many things to buy, and try!
Angela
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Old 2007-07-01, 11:12am
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you've inspired me, those beads are gorgeous!!!!!!!!!i'm headed down to the torch..thanks
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  #13  
Old 2007-07-01, 11:27am
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Candy, I had so much fun looking at all those beads. Thanks so much for sharing that link with us!!
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Old 2007-07-01, 11:43am
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Why can't "I" see Rebeccas beads ????

NICE beadies Candy !!!!
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  #15  
Old 2007-07-01, 11:56am
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Hi Candy!
Thx a lot for those pictures and the detailled information going with them!
Verena
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  #16  
Old 2007-07-01, 2:04pm
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Quote:
Why can't "I" see Rebeccas beads ????
Maybe I don't understand? Can you really not see the picture?

I got an e-mail from LE saying someone (sorry I don't remember the name) posted on here that what I was referring to was called masking. So I came here to read it but it's not here!
Weird!

Angela
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Old 2007-07-01, 2:07pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rverk47 View Post
you've inspired me, those beads are gorgeous!!!!!!!!!i'm headed down to the torch..thanks
Tee Hee. This is so addicting! Now I'm waiting for the wind to die down so please post pictures if you have any luck ok?

EDP is such a crap shoot for me. Sometimes it's pretty and sometimes it's gray pits.

Anyway if If the dang wind dies down I'll see what I can come up with and post other colors if I find any.
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Old 2007-07-01, 2:42pm
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i attempted a few of candy's beads, they came out gorgeous for me, i don't have the perfection that she does but they do look neat.
ziggy what does the wind have to do with whether you post pictures or not???
candy anymore fun charts that have cool reactions etc that you know of??
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Old 2007-07-01, 2:51pm
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Renee, The wind means I can not torch! I have to work outdoors these days.
So my life revolves around the weather. LOL!
When I said I would post other colors I meant write them down here. Taking pictures is a whole other problem. But I won't go there. <G>.
Angela
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Old 2007-07-01, 3:05pm
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As a general rule for Effetre (Moretti) the transparents are stiff and the opaques are soft. If you put a dot of opaque on a transparent base, the dot will spread out. If you put a dot of transparent on an opaque base, the dot will sink in. Within each group, some colors are stiffer and some colors are softer. The aquamarines are among the stiffest of the Effetre transparent colors, if not the absolute stiffest. White and ivory are among the softest of the Effetre opaques. Don't forget that black is a transparent -- it may look like an opaque, but it's actually very dark transparent purple. (Vetrofond black is transparent blue.)

Some colors spread more than others. The greens are notorious. They spread like kudzu, and try to take everything over.

The classic "triangle" bead is a black base (a transparent) with white dots (an opaque) with dots of a couple of deep transparents on top of the white. Because the white dots spread, they carry the deep transparents with them. Of course, the white also makes the transparents show up more.

Either effect -- the spreading out or the sinking in -- gets more pronounced the more you heat the bead. If for some reason you want to use a transparent dot on an opaque base and don't want it to sink in, try to keep the bead as cool as possible to minimize the sinking. The more you heat the bead, the more the dot is going to sink. Likewise, the more you heat an opaque dot on a transparent base, the more it's going to spread.

To get the dots to press against each other and change each other's shape, you need to melt them down at the same time. The dots can't be touching each other before they're melted down, or they'll run together. If the dot isn't standing up straight on the bead before you melt it, it may melt down at an angle (unless the way you heat it straightens it out) and give you a misshapen spot on the bead.

So much for basic dot technique -- if what you want is magic color reactions (which color placed next to which other color will make the first color separate), I haven't a clue. I'll be watching this space too!

(The general rule of transparents being stiff and opaques being soft pretty much holds true for any of the 104 glass. I can't think of any exceptions right now. Bullseye I think is entirely different, and I haven't a glimmer of an idea about Reichenbach.)
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Last edited by Emily; 2007-07-01 at 3:10pm.
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  #21  
Old 2007-07-01, 4:11pm
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I'm wondering what green that is as a base. Not copper green but another. Maybe Nile green, one of my favs. I'm going to try it.
Once I made a EDP base bead with Opal and Copper Green. I just love Copper green on EDP. It makes a darker center. And is so bright! But I dislike fighting the EDP as a base color.
Oh, Coral on EDP I think spreads also!
FWIW,
The wind died down, finally!
Angela
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Old 2007-07-01, 4:15pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emily View Post
As a general rule for Effetre (Moretti) the transparents are stiff and the opaques are soft. If you put a dot of opaque on a transparent base, the dot will spread out. If you put a dot of transparent on an opaque base, the dot will sink in. Within each group, some colors are stiffer and some colors are softer. The aquamarines are among the stiffest of the Effetre transparent colors, if not the absolute stiffest. White and ivory are among the softest of the Effetre opaques. Don't forget that black is a transparent -- it may look like an opaque, but it's actually very dark transparent purple. (Vetrofond black is transparent blue.)

Some colors spread more than others. The greens are notorious. They spread like kudzu, and try to take everything over.

The classic "triangle" bead is a black base (a transparent) with white dots (an opaque) with dots of a couple of deep transparents on top of the white. Because the white dots spread, they carry the deep transparents with them. Of course, the white also makes the transparents show up more.

Either effect -- the spreading out or the sinking in -- gets more pronounced the more you heat the bead. If for some reason you want to use a transparent dot on an opaque base and don't want it to sink in, try to keep the bead as cool as possible to minimize the sinking. The more you heat the bead, the more the dot is going to sink. Likewise, the more you heat an opaque dot on a transparent base, the more it's going to spread.

To get the dots to press against each other and change each other's shape, you need to melt them down at the same time. The dots can't be touching each other before they're melted down, or they'll run together. If the dot isn't standing up straight on the bead before you melt it, it may melt down at an angle (unless the way you heat it straightens it out) and give you a misshapen spot on the bead.

So much for basic dot technique -- if what you want is magic color reactions (which color placed next to which other color will make the first color separate), I haven't a clue. I'll be watching this space too!

(The general rule of transparents being stiff and opaques being soft pretty much holds true for any of the 104 glass. I can't think of any exceptions right now. Bullseye I think is entirely different, and I haven't a glimmer of an idea about Reichenbach.)
Emily, This is great information! It clarifys a lot for me. When you say you must melt the dots at the same time, you don't mean stack them all first and then melt right?....Or do you?
Back to the torch!
Thanks bunches!
Angela
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  #23  
Old 2007-07-01, 4:21pm
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Another one I like. Black, with white dots under Trans., dk. grass green, with Rubino (Gold Pink).
Simple but oh so pretty.
Oops! I tried it again and it didn't work. That's because I used trans. purple, then white under the Rubino. And White under Grass Green.
But the grass green looks good just on black. Doesn't have to have white under it.
FWIW,
Angela
PS: I also like dark trans. purple with white, then lemon yellow then Rubino.
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Old 2007-07-01, 5:03pm
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Re-hi Emily, I think I know what you mean now. You have to melt what ever layer of dots down at the same time so they will spread and form shapes as they bump into the other dots.
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Old 2007-07-01, 5:04pm
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One that I had fun with was copper green base and small dots of Mosiac green, and I mean small. They spread on the CG like crazy!

Oh and generally you add dots and melt in each time
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Old 2007-07-01, 5:18pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ziggys View Post
Emily, This is great information! It clarifys a lot for me. When you say you must melt the dots at the same time, you don't mean stack them all first and then melt right?....Or do you?
I meant that if you have six dots on a bead, you need to melt all six down at once. You can't put one dot on, melt it down flat, make another one, melt it down flat, put another one on, melt it, and so on. Well, obviously you can, but if you do, they won't press against each other, and you won't get the shapes changing.

Now, if you're asking whether you have to stack all of your colors before melting them down, or whether you can add a second (or third or fourth) row of colors after you've already melted in your first row -- I'm not the best person to ask, because I don't do a lot of these beads and I don't get complicated with them when I do. I usually melt my first row down about halfway (not flat), add my next color, then melt the whole thing in. If I discover my dots weren't big enough to get the effect I need, I've added more glass and melted it in, and it's worked, so I guess that's a yes, you can melt in stages, as long as the entire layer gets melted in together. (In other words, don't add a second layer on three petals of a flower, melt it in, then add the second layer on the other petals and expect the flower to stay symmetrical.)

Clear as bead release?

By the way, if you look at Rebecca's beads, you'll see that they break pretty much all of the "rules" in my first post. Except for the rubino, they're opaques, and pretty soft colors. What can I say? Rules were made to be broken, and the girl is good!
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Last edited by Emily; 2007-07-01 at 5:31pm.
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  #27  
Old 2007-07-01, 9:14pm
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Well that was fun! Candy I went nuts trying out colors, on top of colors on top of colors. Not sure if I got much of anything good but I had a blast.

I do know I got one really pretty one with a black base, turquoise, EDP, and Gold Pink, with a little Copper Green I think too. I should have just made a set of those. but I can't leave well enough alone. <G>.
Thanks A Bunch!
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Old 2007-07-01, 9:18pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emily View Post
By the way, if you look at Rebecca's beads, you'll see that they break pretty much all of the "rules" in my first post. Except for the rubino, they're opaques, and pretty soft colors. What can I say? Rules were made to be broken, and the girl is good!
Heh-Heh! That's quite alright. Now I can apply what you wrote to all of my glass and not just the odd ones that happen to do that spreading thing under different circumstances.
I've been wanting to get the difference between Transparant and Opaque glass down for too long. Now I think it's finally imprinted in my brain.

Angela
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Old 2007-07-01, 9:22pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BeadMaven View Post
One that I had fun with was copper green base and small dots of Mosiac green, and I mean small. They spread on the CG like crazy!

Oh and generally you add dots and melt in each time
I have yet to buy any Mosiac Green, but I'm sure wanting to!
Angela
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Old 2007-07-01, 9:43pm
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there was a trainlge tutorial somewhere.
Melissa Melanson I think. Maybe that would help.
Paula
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