Mask to prevent "glassblowers lung"?

ShellyJo1969 · #1 2010-07-12, 1:19am

I knew before I even started buying equipment to start lampworking that there were potentially hazardous conditions that had to be delt with and every precaution taken to prevent injury or future illness.

I installed an over 900cfm vent hood, I am still working on my barley box design but I WILL get one made soon, I open a window for fresh air ventilation and I might get vents put under the bench, but if not I still have adequate fresh air with the window.

So as a newbie, I was feeling pretty good about my set up, and I come across this thread about someone who has been lampworking for 17 years with great ventilation and now has been diagnosed with chronic "glassblowers lung" and COPD and generally sounds like her lungs have turned to mush. Scared the crap out of me! I DO NOT want to do ANYTHING wrong to allow my lungs to become sickly!! I'll wear a full face mask respirator in the heat of summer with my vent hood on if that will prevent me from becomming ill in future.

There are SO many masks out there, I've looked, I'm still looking. I'm researching on a full mask respirator that will filter any stray fumes that could possibly slip past my vent hood (and of course you already have to wear a respirator when using frit/silver glass/heavy lead glass etc) so sounds like a person would be much better off to just wear one all the time when lampworking. And as a newbie, it'll be easier to make it part of the routine now.

WHICH mask do I need? Of course a light weight half mask sounds peachy and not too much trouble, BUT I am not looking for an easy fix. I really REALLY want to make sure I am doing everything possible to keep my lungs safe and from what I"ve read a full face mask is the safest way to go. But which one and where to purchase it online? Do they make them to prevent particulates (frit/powders) and also any stray fumes?

Viewpoints on subject?

How many of you wear a full mask and what kind /where did you purchase?

Be Safe!
Michele

What about this mask?
http://www.airgas.com/browse/product...ct=MSA10028995

Kevan · #2 2010-07-12, 1:39am

Have you done a search on "glass blower's lung"?

ShellyJo1969 · #3 2010-07-12, 1:54am

Yes?

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/469614

http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/j...TRY=1&SRETRY=0

http://oem.bmj.com/content/42/6/411.abstract

Kevan · #4 2010-07-12, 3:13am

Do you intend to be a production glass blower?

Angie09 · #5 2010-07-12, 4:36am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kevan

Do you intend to be a production glass blower?

Hey Kevan ... are your questions intended to be helpful or just snide? It's very difficult to tell.

GlassMigrations · #6 2010-07-12, 6:40am

Michele. I have read many articles in the past regarding GlassBlower's Lung. I also was concerned about the inherent risks since I am a lampwork artist like yourself. The studies have shown an increased risk of lung cancer and even stomach cancer in the glass art industry; however, most studies were done in a high volume glasswork industry/factory. The cold working part of the glass is probably the most worrisome of them all. This involves the grinding of the glass, which disperses the fine particles of what makes up the glass. Most of the study groups that were observed were working in the same building, where the hot glass and cold glass work coexist. And yes, when melting glass that contains metals, there is a chance of exposure to the cancer causing agents in the air you breath. However, if proper ventilation is in place, the air you breath should be safe. I am more worried about getting cancer from the DEA that is still being put in a large amount of hand soaps, shampoos, etc. It is known to cause cancer in the liver and kidneys. Some countries have banned it, but so far not in the U.S. I personally do not wear a mask when I am making beads because I feel safe using the proper ventilation required. However, when I am cleaning my beads, mandrels, using pixie dust, enamels, anything with fine particles, I do wear a mask. If you feel you want to wear a full face mask and that works for you, great. I think it is all a matter of personal choice and how far you want to go taking precautions.

Shrimp · #7 2010-07-12, 7:24am

Angie, I think that Kevan was asking valid questions to find out more in depth what Shelly's goals are, and to direct her to the necessary resources to do her research, if she hadn't been able to find any on her own.

I have a respirator mask, NIOSH OV/P100, made by Gerson. It is supposed to have fume and particle protection. Please, will someone correct me if I am wrong.

Lisi · #8 2010-07-12, 7:37am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aleta

Angie, I think that Kevan was asking valid questions to find out more in depth what Shelly's goals are, and to direct her to the necessary resources to do her research, if she hadn't been able to find any on her own.

I have a respirator mask, NIOSH OV/P100, made by Gerson. It is supposed to have fume and particle protection. Please, will someone correct me if I am wrong.

That's the right type that covers what risks there are with flameworking, Aleta. I'm 100% sure of it.

Dale M. · #9 2010-07-12, 8:26am

If you have good ventilation, the risks of glass blowers lung is very small...

For lampwork a full face respirator is really not necessary, for particle and fume protection on level the average lampwork needs, any half face mask with either P-100 or N-100 filters is adequate....

Something similar to the one in link below is more than adequate for lampwork use as long as it has P100 or N100 filters...

http://www.professionalequipment.com...k-respirators/

Dale

menty666 · #10 2010-07-12, 9:55am

I'm pretty sure Kevan meant, 'have you done a search on here', not the general web, as the question does come up from time to time

NIOS 100 (asbestos level) if you're looking to use one, and for enameling it's all but required.

I have a respirator I wear when I mix up plaster and silica, but I don't wear one when I work with powders, but I also work with them under the vent only.

If you do get a respirator, make sure you store it away from the work area so nothing you're trying to hide from settles inside of it.

ShellyJo1969 · #11 2010-07-12, 1:57pm

to Kevan, I do not intend to do anything with glassblowing literally, only lampworking beads, small scale sculpture, marbles, that type of thing.

to Dale, that sounds reassuring and logical. I was trying to figure out what this person's problem was then if she had all these horrible lung ailments now and she claimed that she had "excellent" ventilation??? It doesn't sound rational that she had that good of ventilation and yet still has all of these lung ailments now does it? Since I can't inspect her setup I guess I'll never know.

I just want to take every feasible precaution and not have any worries take away the new joy I've found in lampworking.

Is there a test I can perform on my ventilation setup to assure it's more than adequate.

Is there some studies out on lampworkers safety and how to best be maximum safe?

I do want to be extremely and overly cautious. My dad had silicosis and chronic COPD when he died and I can tell you that I never ever want to have any of it.

Kevan · #12 2010-07-12, 4:29pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Angie09

Hey Kevan ... are your questions intended to be helpful or just snide? It's very difficult to tell.

I'm just asking.

Why would they be snide?

GlassyEyedGirl · #13 2010-07-12, 4:42pm

It's so hard to tell about people without visual cues, but I feel like Kevan is just a person who gets straight to the point (at least from my observations).

I use a 3M half face respirator with the #2097 P100 filters. I am extra sensitive to fumes.

Angie09 · #14 2010-07-12, 5:14pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kevan

Do you intend to be a production glass blower?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kevan

I'm just asking.

Why would they be snide?

The original post stated that she was interested in lampworking and was a newbie so your response about "production work" seemed (to me) to be more sarcastic. Perhaps I just read it wrong.

Kevan · #15 2010-07-12, 5:22pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Angie09

The original post stated that she was interested in lampworking and was a newbie so your response about "production work" seemed (to me) to be more sarcastic. Perhaps I just read it wrong.

I thought maybe she was planning on going into production.

They never have studies on people who make beads a couple of hours a day several times a week. People who work in an industrial glass blowing shop are exposed to a whole lot more toxic fumes and not just toxic fumes, they are breathing bits of glass all the time, they are swallowing it, too. Every time glass shatters tiny particles of glass dust are released into the air. An ever so slight increase in the number of stomach cancer cases in some industrial shops in Sweden really doesn't seem conclusive.

If it's something you are worried about, wear a respirator. Of course, it might be from swallowing glass dust, not breathing fumes.

Does anyone know anyone who is a lampworker who has contracted "glass blower's lung"?

Dale M. · #16 2010-07-12, 5:45pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShellyJo1969

...
I was trying to figure out what this person's problem was then if she had all these horrible lung ailments now and she claimed that she had "excellent" ventilation??? It doesn't sound rational that she had that good of ventilation and yet still has all of these lung ailments now does it? Since I can't inspect her setup I guess I'll never know.

Who is this mysterious person and is there a link to her story....

Dale

jamie lynne · #17 2010-07-12, 5:49pm

Didn't Heidi Von Frozenfire quit lampworking after getting a severe case of blowers lung? I could swear she did. She left LE because she didn't like knowing that we were all slowly poisoning ourselves.

Kevan · #18 2010-07-12, 5:52pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by jamie lynne

Didn't Heidi Von Frozenfire quit lampworking after getting a severe case of blowers lung? I could swear she did. She left LE because she didn't like knowing that we were all slowly poisoning ourselves.

I was under the impression that she has worked in the glass blowing industry in Germany or something.

jamie lynne · #19 2010-07-12, 6:00pm

Could be Kevan... I don't know much about her. I just remember her being really upset.

ShellyJo1969 · #20 2010-07-12, 7:26pm

Heidi von Frozenfire IS the person I'm talking about. Her's is the thread that freaked me out quite a bit.

About production, if you mean am I going to be doing it on an ongoing daily basis to sell for profit, that's is the plan. Is that referred to as production? I'm was not planning on just doing it a few hours a week as a hobby, no. More like daily for several hours, you know, like a job. Is that production?

Dale, Yes, Here's the link to the thread, it's somewhere on that page:
http://www.lampworketc.com/forums/sh...23#post2742123

There is more of her statements somewhere that I cannot find now. She stated that she had been diagnosed with glassblowers lung coughing up blood and she'd quit lampworking after 17 yrs and that she'd always had excellent ventilation (except when she taught classes somewhere a few times?). I just don't know. Probably somebody who's been on here longer than I have could locate it all better. Basically she was warning everyone off of lampworking before they got lung disease like she'd been diagnosed with (even though she says she had excellent ventilation). It was terribly scary.

But I just keep thinking about it and I just don't understand how you could get lung problems if you did things properly? Maybe what Kevan said has a lot of truth in it. Maybe it's not just the fumes, it might be microscopic particles of glass when working with glass or perhaps when the rods pop when you're working them? Or hell it might be when you're grinding it, and I don't intend to do that and if i did I'd be wearing a mask, definitely.

Whatever the truth is, looks like proper ventilation and wearing a mask for fumes plus particulates should prevent any potential problems. Right?

Kevan · #21 2010-07-12, 7:52pm

I thought she worked in a glass factory kind of situation.

Dale M. · #22 2010-07-12, 7:56pm

One persons problem and her reaction to it does not make it epidemic among lampworkers.... Not to minimizer her plight, but there is not enough information to form a valid conclusion....

Dale

jamie lynne · #23 2010-07-12, 7:57pm

I think there are several people on here that are friends with her on FB (I'm not one of those lucky people) perhaps they could ask her to come in and let us know what kind of environment she was in during her glass making days. I'd also just like to say hi to her. She was the funniest person, I miss her quirkiness.

vetropod · #24 2010-07-12, 8:05pm

This doesn't clarify on this topic at all, but Heidi was a glass dildo maker FYI.

Shrimp · #25 2010-07-12, 8:13pm

And your point?

ShellyJo1969 · #26 2010-07-12, 8:24pm

hi beast master, yes I knew that she made them cause I looked up everything I could find when she posted that. I don't guess it does clarify, but it's kind of interesting.

It might be good though if anybody could find her and ask her to check in here. Although on the threads I already read she seemed to be very adamant about warning off fellow lampworkers before they also got riddled with the disease she'd been diagnosed with as she seemed or her doctor seemed to think it was totally glass related.

You are right dale, not really enough info to be diagnosing with.

Are there no health studies about the lung health of lampworkers who actually work in proper safety environments as compared to those who are now ill or obviously are no longer with us because they didn't? That would be a great resource for all lampworkers and newbie lampworkers.

So we all agree that proper ventilation procedures coupled with a P100 fume/particulate half mask is THE safest way to go right?

ShellyJo1969 · #27 2010-07-12, 8:24pm

Oh and can someone tell me about any sort of test that I can perform to make positive that my ventilation system is doing exactly what it's supposed to?

Shrimp · #28 2010-07-12, 8:45pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShellyJo1969

Oh and can someone tell me about any sort of test that I can perform to make positive that my ventilation system is doing exactly what it's supposed to?

Here is an excellent thread to research:

http://lampworketc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=151981

And here is a link from within the thread that gives a good visual demo of a ventillation system testing:

http://img697.imageshack.us/i/smoketest.mp4/

menty666 · #29 2010-07-12, 9:28pm

I think the point about the dildos was that Heidi was doing lathe work day in and day out which means she was up close and personal with the hot glass BUT ALSO the machinery itself.

Dale's right. While no one disputes her diagnosis, there are plenty of other folks in the industry who've been at it for as long if not longer that are fine, like Lewis Wilson, Bob Snodgrass, and a few other 'old timers'. So there's no direct link that ultimately working with glass will lead to your health declining.

It *used* to be the norm that blowing glass would shorten your life span considerably, but there have been leaps in ventilation, requirements for it in factories, materials handling etc. While not everyone here does everything they should all the time, most of us are fairly safety conscious since none of us particularly want to be harmed in the process.

Generally speaking as a ventilation test, you can try a smoke test. Ideally if you fill your area with smoke, it should be cleared out very rapidly when you turn on the ventilation. The only caveat there is that most folks will test from outside the room where when you're actually there by the torch your presence disrupts the airflow in what will be the "typical" manner. So if you can put a you sized mass in your seat, so much the better.

menty666 · #30 2010-07-12, 9:29pm

Oh, and unless she came back, Heide bugged out of facebook too a while back.