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  #1  
Old 2012-05-02, 5:18am
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Default Lead in multicolor dark?

Anyone know if there is any lead in multicolor dark, 104 coe? I know the 96 coe frit line for Reichenbach has many colors with lead in it but i have no idea about their 104 cane. (I have a customer that is asking.)

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  #2  
Old 2012-05-02, 5:34am
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Yes.
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"And all will turn to silver glass, a light on the water, grey ships pass into the west." Annie Lennox
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Old 2012-05-02, 5:43am
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Lead is in a lot of colours, it's not necessarily unsafe
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Old 2012-05-02, 6:03am
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I have had only one customer in thousands that has asked me if there is lead in lampwork glass. I wonder if it's the same customer...
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Old 2012-05-02, 6:08am
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Personally, I'd be more worried about nickel. Lead doesn't break out my skin like nickel does.
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Old 2012-05-02, 6:27am
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The customer I had wanted to be able to write in her descriptions that her jewelry was 100% lead free.
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  #7  
Old 2012-05-02, 6:36am
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I wouldn't just be worried about multicolor dark, then. Normal colours like emerald green, for example, are said to have lead as well. Lots of colours.

Crystal glasses generally have lead - it helps them sparkle. Same applies to lampworking glass, and in helping to form colours. Good luck.
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Old 2012-05-02, 7:12am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lisi View Post
The customer I had wanted to be able to write in her descriptions that her jewelry was 100% lead free.
It's different to lead in metal components, the lead is not freely available from glass, you would literally have to suck on the beads for an extended period of time, like days to get any measurable amount of lead

Lead on the surface is different, but it's still minor
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Old 2012-05-02, 7:30am
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Thanks everyone, I figured it would be likely. I bet it is the same person Lisi. It's like a lot of safety things, understanding why and how lead is/becomes a hazard is more important imo than just avoiding something altogether. But, to each their own as the saying goes.

Swamper - I too think, nickel is a concern even though I don't personally react to it. Do you have problems wearing beads made of particular colors due to nickel content? I've stayed with sterling silver for jewelry pieces because I worry about that issue with german silver but never considered reactivity to the beads themselves.

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Old 2012-05-02, 7:41am
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Thanks Deb, I agree with you. But to someone who wants to state that everything is 100% lead free the real vs perceived hazard from lead doesn't seem to be their concern. I did try to explain some of these points.

My kids actually ended up with detectable levels of heavy metals in their blood while my Ex and I were renovating our house when they young. Another family member didn't believe me when I told them all the painted wood needed to be taken to the dump and not burned in the wood stove. I came home from work one day and found that a lot of wood that I had not carted away myself had been burned that day, and boy was I angry. I had the kids tested and luckily the levels weren't high enough to need treatment but it was completely avoidable. The person responsible felt terrible but I wish they had just understood and believed me in the first place.
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Old 2012-05-02, 7:59am
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Tina, I have not had a reaction to any of the beads I have made so glass doesn't seem to be an issue but I sure do break out from contact with cheap metal in jewelry...mostly the backs of watches. I don't even wear a watch anymore.
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  #12  
Old 2012-05-02, 10:37am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silverlilly1 View Post
I wouldn't just be worried about multicolor dark, then. Normal colours like emerald green, for example, are said to have lead as well. Lots of colours.

Crystal glasses generally have lead - it helps them sparkle. Same applies to lampworking glass, and in helping to form colours. Good luck.
It is not a good assumption that most soft glasses have lead. It has become prohibitively expensive to buy and handle. Therefore a lot of the color companies have worked to eliminate it from their product line where possible.
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  #13  
Old 2012-05-02, 11:27am
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I didn't say that MOST have lead, just that lots do.

The comment about crystal glasses was about crystal glasses (drinking vessels, candlesticks, etc), not rods of glass. Crystal is expensive.

"Same applies to lampwork glass..." - Lead helps lampwork glass sparkle, too. It can help glass, in general, sparkle, when it's used in that manner.

"and in helping to form colours" - Lead is used in some glass recipes as a part of creating the glass colour.

These statements are correct. I'm not sure why I have to defend every comment I make.

Last edited by silverlilly1; 2012-05-02 at 11:36am.
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Old 2012-05-02, 11:35am
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It's also become a sticky legal matter. Check out the Consumer Products Safety Improvement Act. If you have more than 90ppm lead on the surface of anything that will be used (or perhaps even contacted) by a child under 12 you are subject to substantial fines ($10K or so). That's why BoC put a ban on metallic reduction glass surfaces. Some metallic glass surfaces are silver, zinc or manganese but some are lead and you can't tell the difference by looking at them.

I've tested quite a few colors and lead isn't that common anymore but it turns up now and then. Lead is disappearing quickly from new formulations but a lot of the old stock is still out there moving through the market.

IMHO it's a reasonable question to ask of your suppliers.

Robert
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  #15  
Old 2012-05-02, 11:39am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silverlilly1 View Post
These statements are correct. I'm not sure why I have to defend every comment I make.
That often happens when making broad generalizations.
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Old 2012-05-02, 11:41am
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Robert, does that mean that silver glass is allowed IN BoC beads, as long as they are encased or are glass types that don't have a metallic sheen (produce only colours instead)?

Technically, the colours are caused by metals, so that one is less likely to be okay, but encasing should prevent any contact.
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Old 2012-05-02, 11:51am
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I am not the only one to have made a broad statement on this thread, but am apparently the only one under attack. "Therefore a lot of the color companies have worked to eliminate it from their product line where possible," is also a broad generalization. So is, "Lead is in a lot of colours." Neither of those statements are mine, but both are in this thread, and neither have been or are being attacked.

Apparently I am not allowed to comment in any thread that LarryC likes, and I don't want to argue or constantly defend myself. It's a waste of my time and emotions. Not that I can't defend what I say. I will leave this thread to you in peace. Attacks are a good way to drive people away from this forum...

Last edited by silverlilly1; 2012-05-02 at 11:58am.
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  #18  
Old 2012-05-02, 12:16pm
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As an aside, I was happy to see that Double Helix does post the lead content of their glass colors.
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  #19  
Old 2012-05-02, 12:45pm
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Silver glass is allowed so long as it is encased and no metallic surfaces are showing. Clear sequesters any reduced metals where they can't be contacted.
I was very pleased to see DH post their lead content in their glass.

Robert
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  #20  
Old 2012-05-02, 3:57pm
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Talking Lead Analysis Data Summary

Quote:
Originally Posted by SilverReflections View Post
As an aside, I was happy to see that Double Helix does post the lead content of their glass colors.
The "lead content" being functionally zero in all of our colors, with the exception of Gaia, an older color made using Italian cullet as an ingredient. Gaia, which tested at 475 ug/g, is the only color that did not qualify as "Lead Free". The CPSIA permissible limit for lead content is 300 ug/g (PPM). Gaia is made using Italian Emerald Green 591030.
A 2012 new release production color, Oxalis (OX-380), has been formulated from scratch to offer an alternative to Gaia, with zero lead content, stronger luster effects, and an unusual green tone not found in commercial glasses. Oxalis will be available later in the year.

We also do not use Nickel, Cadmium, Selenium, Arsenic, Antimony, or Chromium in any of our production colors.

Some Lead Crystals use up to 65% Lead Oxide as batch ingredients. I'm not sure how that translates into PPM in finished glassware, but it must be a bunch.

Here's a LINK to the CPSIA website for those who are interested.

Thanks,
Jed and Julie at Double Helix Glassworks
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  #21  
Old 2012-05-02, 5:48pm
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That would be 650000ppm. A whopping amount to be sure
The question is whether a metallic reduction surface constitutes a coating or not. The 90ppm comes from the paint and coating rule. I think that the key word in the rule is 'similar' and how the word is defined. To my knowledge there has not been a test case on this point yet.

'Section 101. Children's Products Containing Lead; Lead Paint Rule
In addition, after 1 year or August 14, 2009, the Act provides that paint and similar surface-coating materials for consumer use must be reduced from 600 ppm to 90 ppm.' (http://www.cpsc.gov/about/cpsia/sect101.html)

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  #22  
Old 2012-05-03, 6:45am
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Well, now she's asked me too. She should be more concerned with the cheap dichroic heart and glass toggle on the necklace that sells for $13.00 than any of our beads! Which BTW, she does not mention anything about lead content.
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Old 2012-05-03, 8:54am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RSimmons View Post
That would be 650000ppm. A whopping amount to be sure
The question is whether a metallic reduction surface constitutes a coating or not. The 90ppm comes from the paint and coating rule. I think that the key word in the rule is 'similar' and how the word is defined. To my knowledge there has not been a test case on this point yet.

'Section 101. Children's Products Containing Lead; Lead Paint Rule
In addition, after 1 year or August 14, 2009, the Act provides that paint and similar surface-coating materials for consumer use must be reduced from 600 ppm to 90 ppm.' (http://www.cpsc.gov/about/cpsia/sect101.html)

R
Yup. I consider it clear as mud Because of this, as a rule, I encase all drinking vessels that I sell in clear and stay away from reducing color lip wraps. What are others doing?
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Old 2012-05-03, 5:56pm
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I encase any questionable glass in clear or transparent of some sort that I'm sure doesn't contain lead. When in doubt, I test it.

Robert
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Old 2012-05-03, 9:26pm
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I encase any questionable glass in clear or transparent of some sort that I'm sure doesn't contain lead. When in doubt, I test it.

Robert
Where do you get the test medium?
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  #26  
Old 2012-05-04, 6:16pm
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I use an X-ray spectrometer. They're a little hard to come by but I happen to have access to one that I can buy time on. Sometimes being a certified science geek has it's finer moments.

Robert
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  #27  
Old 2012-05-04, 6:39pm
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Someones asking me too... are people getting questioned on Etsy?
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Old 2012-05-04, 7:49pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by *Naos* View Post
Someones asking me too... are people getting questioned on Etsy?
That's where mine came from.
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Old 2012-05-05, 8:47pm
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Someones asking me too... are people getting questioned on Etsy?
Yep
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Old 2012-05-06, 7:54am
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The last and only time I was asked about this was about two years ago.
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