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Safety -- Make sure you are safe! |
2010-02-18, 10:50am
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Oct 24, 2005
Location: SW Michigan
Posts: 825
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glasscraft hood, original fan?
Does anyone actually use the glasscraft hood as it is with the original fan or does everyone replace the fan?
I'm just getting the studio set up after moving, many months away from the torch. We currently have the hood hooked up and it goes directly out the window, no additional ducting. We have the window blocked with a board and a hole cut for the fan vent to go out, silicone any gaps. I'm also thinking of adding sheet metal baffles to the side, but have not done that yet.
Anyway, at this point, it seems to pass the smoke test. But I'm a little leary since it seems like everyone has upgraded to a higher fan. Is it possible that this system is working because of the short distance out the window?
thanks-
Ana
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2010-02-18, 10:59am
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da General
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Join Date: Oct 05, 2006
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 13,002
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The original fan that came with the GlassCraft hood was about 200-250 CFM. Even with the baffles on three sides and no ducting, it's not strong enough for the size of the hood. We replaced ours shortly after getting it and realizing that the 650 CFM (or something close to that, can't remember the exact number) per GlassCraft's specs was only when it's used as a booster fan.
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Hayley
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2010-02-18, 11:07am
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My lab pups - Mojo & Babe
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Join Date: Jun 02, 2008
Location: Severn, MD
Posts: 236
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So glad I stumbled across this thread. I use the Glasscraft set up as-is and wondered if I should put in a stronger fan. Does anyone know what type or brand of fan to use to upgrade this to about 650cfm? And where I can buy one?
Really appreciate any advise. Thanks!
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2010-02-18, 11:40am
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a pox upon an idiot :..
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Join Date: Jul 01, 2005
Location: in the real world...
Posts: 1,298
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I have the Glasscraft hood,(since 2001), but purchased it with the two fans that were available. I installed metal baffles on 3 sides and it works extremely well. After it was installed I had a HVAC guy come out and test everything and it passed with flying colors.
My baffles are aluminum furnace ducting that I installed with self piloting screws. If you're concerned about how well your hood is working it might be a good idea to have someone come out and check how well it is exhausting your fumes.
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2010-02-18, 6:57pm
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Nov 21, 2008
Location: Herndon, VA
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You can also do a quick test yourself. With your torch running, set off a smoky source (like a smoke bomb) next to your torch. The fumes should get sucked into the exit of the vent hood in less than 2 seconds.
Robert Simmons did a very nice job adapting a Glasscraft hood with a right-sized fan. He replaced the one that came with the hood with a squirrel cage fan. If you search on his posts, you'll find some pictures he was kind enough to post and some descriptions on what he did.
Hayey, I want to remember you doing the same thing. One of the last posts I remember seeing of your set up was when you upgraded to an in-line fan. Hope I'm remembering correctly - they were also good pics.
I bought ~950 cfm inline fan from Fantech for one of my workstations and ~1200 cfm for a larger one, also from Fantech. Other good in-line fans for our needs are from Vortech and CanFan. Interestingly, hydroponic shops seem to carry these, as well as some plumbing/HVAC places. Good squirrel cage fans are pretty easy to find - folks here have posted finding good ones used on places like Craig's list.
Linda
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2010-02-18, 8:36pm
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da General
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Join Date: Oct 05, 2006
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 13,002
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Yes, Linda, I replaced my GlassCraft hood fan with this one.
http://www.amazon.com/Can-Fan-Max-10.../dp/B001IA1UZA
This is our old set up - we have since widen the hood to accommodate two torches. You can barely see where the fan is installed within the ducting, it's at the upper right corner of the picture - you can see the 2x6 blocking above it attaching the metal bracket to the ceiling. The fan is very heavy and needs to be attached well.
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Hayley
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2010-02-19, 7:13am
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Oct 24, 2005
Location: SW Michigan
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Thanks all. Yes, it passes the smoke test, but I was wondering how, since everyone else seemed to have issues.
Now I haven't tried smoke in other parts of the room, just at different points around the table where the torch is located. Maybe I should do that to see how long it takes to clear out of the whole room?
I'll keep an eye on it, we just hooked it up again last weekend. I'll try it a few more times to see if there are other factors affecting the test.
thanks!
Ana
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2010-02-19, 8:21am
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da General
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Join Date: Oct 05, 2006
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 13,002
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I'd upgrade the fan. If you have seen an old issue of the Annealer magazine with an article showing how a bead in the flame affects the thermal plume, you may see that the smoke test is not an accurate representation of that.
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Hayley
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2010-02-21, 9:08am
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Gentleman of Leisure
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Join Date: Jun 10, 2005
Location: A Little Bit West of Yosemite Valley
Posts: 5,200
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bakerman44
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The flaw was the fan was to small in amount of air that needed to be moved, the solution was larger fan, their choice was to not improve system with bigger fan but to abandon system..... Their loss, our loss.....
Dale
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San Francisco - A Few Toys Short of a Happy Meal
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2010-02-21, 9:12am
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Nov 21, 2008
Location: Herndon, VA
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Haley - Thanks for posting a pic of your system here. You also have an excellent system. I remember reading your posts as you were deciding to upgrade to the fan you note, below. I found your thought process and the information you posted to be very helpful, myself
Ana - I'd recommend seaching on Haley's posts, too, for her discussions on her upgrades. I think you'll find them most valuable, like Robert's posts. Haley's recommendation to look up the article in the Annealer (either spring of 2009 or spring of 2008, I think) is a very good idea. I found it eye-opening, myself.
I'm glad Classcraft discontinued their standard product - their original fan was too small for just about all of our requirements. While the hood itself is nice, it's too bad they didn't take more time to design it with a better fan.
Linda
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hayley
Yes, Linda, I replaced my GlassCraft hood fan with this one.
http://www.amazon.com/Can-Fan-Max-10.../dp/B001IA1UZA
This is our old set up - we have since widen the hood to accommodate two torches. You can barely see where the fan is installed within the ducting, it's at the upper right corner of the picture - you can see the 2x6 blocking above it attaching the metal bracket to the ceiling. The fan is very heavy and needs to be attached well.
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2010-02-22, 10:22am
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Curmudgeon Engineering
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Join Date: Feb 15, 2006
Location: Near Seattle, WA
Posts: 1,723
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I have no connection to Glasscraft but as is true in a lot of products the design is an idea put on paper, the math is done and then someone else who gets lower pay is tasked with finding and specing (word?) the parts. The parts are searched for in catalogues and purchased based on the catalogue speciifications. The original fan was supposedly 650 cfm. Other specs that might have disqualified the fan were perhaps not there, missed or ignored. Glasscraft's easiest route to discontinue the product was probably the most cost effective.
NMLinda, very nice looking work area.
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2010-02-22, 4:44pm
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Nov 21, 2008
Location: Herndon, VA
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I can't take credit for the work area - that's Haley's haven!
Linda
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2010-02-22, 8:51pm
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Gentleman of Leisure
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Join Date: Jun 10, 2005
Location: A Little Bit West of Yosemite Valley
Posts: 5,200
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As for the fan in the Glasscraft hood.... It was originally a SUNCOURT 210...
Rated at about 300 CFM in free air of 650 cfm in duct booster fan mode....
http://www.suncourt.com/Inductor_Pro.html
When the people at Glasscraft were brought into discussion.... Their response was " our ventilation guy does not do internet" if you want information call him.......
I guess they were not very interested in dealing with issue.... All it would have takes is a fan upgrade......All the would have has to do in upgrade to higher cfm fan... (somewhere way back in archive the thread probably still exists - maybe several years ago)
Edit to Add:
http://www.lampworketc.com/forums/sh...40#post1522940
Their failure to rectify situation was a sever loss to them and the glass industry....
Dale
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San Francisco - A Few Toys Short of a Happy Meal
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2010-02-22, 9:14pm
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Formerly Icarus Beads :)
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Join Date: Jul 04, 2009
Location: Morgan Hill, CA
Posts: 2,245
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You can get the fan also through Ebay, a bit cheaper:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Can-Fan-Max-10-1...item1e5a799ac0
Hayley, I do have the Glasscraft hood (similar set up as yours, also facing the wall), and the ducting goes from the hood straight out the wall. So we have the current Glasscraft fan installed in the wall (hope that makes sense) instead of installing in a seperate "box". Do you think this particular can fan could be installed the same way?
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2010-02-22, 9:25pm
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da General
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Join Date: Oct 05, 2006
Location: San Francisco
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Judith - you must have gap for the original fan, right? The CAN fan pictured above is about 7-8" deep. You can probably just swap them out? The CAN fan is heavy tho so you need to brace it from the ceiling.
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Hayley
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2010-02-22, 9:49pm
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Formerly Icarus Beads :)
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Hayley, yes there is a space. I feel like an idiot for not checking first. So the fan is in fact not sitting in the wall, but in a circular piece of steel. Does that actually make sense? Don't know the English name for it ... jeck, I don't even know the German name for it. Definitely larger than what I would call a pipe. And after that unflexible piece (maybe it's also called ducting), there's the flexible ducting coming and going straight into the wall.
Maybe I should make some pics, right? Back in a minute ...
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2010-02-22, 10:04pm
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Formerly Icarus Beads :)
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Ok, back from the garage. So here is my current set up from different angles. The current original fan is sitting in the unflexible piece of ducting, which is currently braced to a wall mounted cabinet above.
And sorry if I'm hijacking this thread ... but I thought it's also related, because I do have the impression the original Glasscraft fan is not doing it's job properly. And yes, I'm planning to still put sheets on the sides and behind the hood to focus the fumes to go up.
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2010-02-22, 10:11pm
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da General
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Join Date: Oct 05, 2006
Location: San Francisco
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Judith - you can probably just swap out the old fan with the CAN. I use foil tape to wrap the fan to the ducting. The CAN fans comes with a metal bracket (shown on the bottom of the fan in the picture with two fans). I turned the fan upside down as the pictured and mounted the bracket on a piece of 2" x 6" which in turn was bolted to the ceiling (you can see the bracket in upper right corner of my picture - it's right under the wood block and next to the ceiling light). It looks like you are able to build up a couple pieces of wood to do the same.
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Hayley
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2010-02-22, 10:33pm
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Formerly Icarus Beads :)
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Thanks Hayley.
Yes, I could build some wooden bracket around the current unflexible ducting to support the new fan, as obviously it must be much heavier than the current, lightweight fan.
Was wondering mainly if I could fit it into the current ducting or if I have to custom build some structure around the fan and how to connect the different pieces.
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2010-02-22, 10:50pm
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da General
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The CAN is made to fit inside the 10" ducting - just get some foil tape to wrap around the connection after you mount it from the ceiling. Yes, it's much heavier than the wimpy original fan.
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Hayley
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2010-02-23, 12:56am
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Formerly Icarus Beads :)
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Sounds like a good plan. Thanks for your help Hayley.
Now I "just" need to rake in the money
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2011-09-13, 11:35am
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Confused as usual
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Join Date: Jun 17, 2011
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 328
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I did up grade the fan in the glasscraft hood My husband is an OSHA safety guy and he made sure the fan was the correct size. However I have a HH and do not think I need such a big hood so I am getting a smaller hood same size fan
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2011-09-13, 11:40am
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Storm Queen
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Location: SQUIDVILLE
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jazarra
I did up grade the fan in the glasscraft hood My husband is an OSHA safety guy and he made sure the fan was the correct size. However I have a HH and do not think I need such a big hood so I am getting a smaller hood same size fan
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If your husband is an "OSHA safety guy" and knows what the correct fan size should be, then why do you need help with ventilation questions?
http://lampworketc.com/forums/showth...24#post3702724
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2011-09-13, 11:51am
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Confused as usual
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Join Date: Jun 17, 2011
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 328
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AKDesigns
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because he has no idea about glass lampworking I am actually the one who led him to info on that he does welding and metal shop safety . Maybe I should clarify since I am going to be attacked here also .He is a safety coordinator for his company and has taken extensive osha training for that job position . so he does have to know about ventilation just not as to how much is needed for glass or silver glass even thats why all the questions .I hope that helps to satisfy you . I will not ask any more ventilation questions I see that I will not get anywhere with some of you Thanks so much have a Great Day
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2011-09-13, 8:05pm
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Curmudgeon Engineering
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Join Date: Feb 15, 2006
Location: Near Seattle, WA
Posts: 1,723
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Jazarra,
Perhaps the tone of answer conveighed the wrong impression. Please do not stop asking questions on any subject but particularly on a subject as important as ventilation. A lot of my experience was in welding also. The welding environment is harsher or at least as harsh as glass working but the contaminants are different and less visible; no less dangerous.
Also please do not feel you are being attacked. I think AKDesigns merely wanted to know why your DH wasn't conversant with glass working requirements. How would he be as there is almost no literature or experience out there in this field on the professional level anyway.
Again, please ask your questions. They provide answers not only to you but to those who didn't ask but wanted the info.
PJH
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