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2007-06-24, 2:16pm
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Jun 20, 2007
Posts: 545
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A beginner looking for some help
hi, im just starting on glass beads and i would like to know what do you call a mandrel, i know that is the pole were you stick the beads but, do you buy it somewhere or you just use any pointing material, what resists the flam?
im still waiting for the arrival of my first material to start
what do you recomend me, im just buying the glass rods and bead release to start, and a little torch with a very little gas deposit
is this right?
i cant aford a kiln or oxygen and propane torch yet or even glasses do you know what can i use instead of that expensive purple glasses? here in portugal there isnt a place to buy them i think, or do they sell them at a torch selling shop?
sry for my english, and thanks for the help
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2007-06-24, 2:36pm
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Aug 12, 2006
Location: Benton Arkansas USA
Posts: 2,167
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mandrel is made from a stanless steel welding rod. You cut them Approx. 12 in . long and dip them in bead release before you start making beads. Some release can cured in theflame and some have to dry naturally.Ant tool you use can stanless steel. Use a kitchen butter knief etc. But keep water by your torch to dip it in to cool or it will stick to your bead when it gets hot. You can buy the galsses on ebay and on the net. You need a kilin or get someone to anneal them for you. A thermo blanket is one way to coo them. And then you can havesomeone to anneal them for you.
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2007-06-24, 2:40pm
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Aug 12, 2006
Location: Benton Arkansas USA
Posts: 2,167
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you also need ventilation to torch. Check out Safty link for info on ventilation. And tips, techniques & Questions link here will help you also.Look at the link studio and you can get a ideal what you need. I didnt start till I watched some video on making glass beads. And could buy the torch and things I needed to do it with. You cant use just any torch. Buy I,m sure you know that. Those little things you get to sauder piped wont work. Good luck hope this helps. Mary
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2007-06-24, 2:42pm
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Forever Grateful Beads
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Join Date: Sep 17, 2005
Location: Bellevue, Washington
Posts: 429
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Hi again smiltroy!
A mandrel is made of steel, and comes in different sizes (depending on how big you want the bead hole to be). The most common sizes are 1/16" and 3/32". In the US, we can buy them at welding supply places or glass art businesses.
The glasses that you see that have purple lenses are specifically for lampworking. You must have glasses specifically for lampworking to save your eyes. It isn't just that the lens is purple, it's actually a lens that filters out the soda flare in the flame.
I buy a lot of my supplies through Frantz Art Glass. They have a website that you can look through to get ideas about what you might need (even if you can't buy through them, you can at least see some products). Here is a link to their website where they have a section for beginner's kits. You might want to take a look at what is in the kits. This will give you an idea of what you might need to get started:
http://www.frantzartglass.com/items....92F3C7}&Bc=KIT
Have fun,
Amy
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2007-06-24, 3:03pm
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Jun 20, 2007
Posts: 545
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thank you so much amy and mary, ill try to learn more as i go
what is the damage to my eyes if i dont buy the glasses? i just cant afford them right now, do you recomend strongly against doing so?
i would love so much buying trough us sites but when they get here to portugal there is too much burocracy to receive what i bought, and beside that i have to pay taxes and time of storage... lots of things to take us our money but ill maybe buy something sometime, even do i have to go trough so much work
thanks for the help amy, ill be trying to do some of your beads, they are just gourgeous, and one of the reasons i want so much to start lampworking
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2007-06-24, 3:41pm
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Aug 12, 2006
Location: Benton Arkansas USA
Posts: 2,167
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No I wouldnt torch without glasses or ventilation. There are several vidios on you tube that will help you. just type in lampwork bead making and watch them they will help you alot. I would wait till Ihad the glasses and torch and ventilation. That is the safe way to torch. Check out the links here on LE. They help alot also.Good Luck to you. Mary
QUOTE=smiltroy;1235554]thank you so much amy and mary, ill try to learn more as i go
what is the damage to my eyes if i dont buy the glasses? i just cant afford them right now, do you recomend strongly against doing so?
i would love so much buying trough us sites but when they get here to portugal there is too much burocracy to receive what i bought, and beside that i have to pay taxes and time of storage... lots of things to take us our money but ill maybe buy something sometime, even do i have to go trough so much work
thanks for the help amy, ill be trying to do some of your beads, they are just gourgeous, and one of the reasons i want so much to start lampworking [/quote]
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2007-06-25, 5:22am
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Life is change. Love it
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Join Date: Oct 10, 2005
Location: Ontario Canada
Posts: 5,566
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Not only do you risk damage to your eyes, it's pretty much impossible to see what you are doing without the glasses to filter out the soda flare. It would be challenging to even make a round bead without being able to see the bead in the flame.
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cRlyn, cause Traci says so
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2007-06-25, 5:41am
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Jul 17, 2006
Location: Aberdeenshire, Scotland
Posts: 530
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Take a look at Glassworks.be in Belgium, they are very friendly and there should be no tax to pay within Europe.
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Mary
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2007-06-25, 6:15am
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Jun 20, 2007
Posts: 545
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yes, im buying there my first glass rods and bead release, but cant afford to buy glasses, mandrils, kilns, oxygen, torch, etc, yet. i want so much to begin and having the rods and the bead release sitting there without beeing able to use them its gonna be very sad
im not even sure also what torch to use, ive seen the hothead torches that are ones that i can afford in the near future, but i just see a pointing thing, dont know if i need anything beside the tube that links that to the propane?!?! gas, the oxygen/propane torches are very expensive to me, but they do have a base to sit on the tabble, the hothead torch i see i dont know how to hold it to the table.
thank you all for the help
hope im not bothering you all
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2007-06-25, 7:36am
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Crispy Critter
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Join Date: Jun 05, 2005
Location: Memphis, TN
Posts: 3,300
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If you can't even afford a Hothead torch, maybe this is not something you want to get into. Lampwork is very expensive, especially at the outset. You really must have glasses, decent ventilation, and all the other safety equipment. There is a big learning curve with lampwork and you are going to waste a LOT of glass and tanks of gas while you practice. I'm not trying to be mean, but I hate to see you waste your money if you don't go into this with a realistic expectation of how much this is going to cost. Good luck to you!
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2007-06-25, 8:06am
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The Andrea Half
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Join Date: Aug 18, 2006
Location: Georgia
Posts: 1,411
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There are some threads about attaching a Hothead torch to a table. BAsically, you need a bracket that looks like the letter L, a C-clamp, and something to bind the hose or the small propane canister to the L-bracket--a worm-drive round clamp is ideal (i.e. one you cantighten with a screwdriver).
What Chris said is important, though--look at your finances. You don't need the full setup to practice, because it is going to take you a while to bring your skills to the point where you can consider selling what you make.
I began lampworking in August 2006, and spent my first months making baby beads to acquire and improve my skills. I didn't have a kiln, just a fiber blanket, and I either didn't anneal beads (they just went into my learning jar) or got friends to batch anneal them for me. With the HotHead the soda flare was not so bad that I desperately needed glasses, but they were my absolutely first purchase when I got more money (within a couple of weeks). I wear glasses just to see, so I had eye protection from popping glass--do not EVER torch without that at least. (And oh, I wish Aura Lens still made clipons!!!)
It was only when I got to the point where I felt I could begin giving beads and beaded items as gifts, and selling them, that I bought a kiln. If you don't want to sell beads, the point where you really begin liking your beads is where you'd want a kiln. DON'T THINK ABOUT SELLING UNANNEALED BEADS, please!!!
As for a torch, I am impatient and bought a used Bobcat, but many beadmakers, like NLC and Naos, use the HotHead regularly or exclusively; having a HotHead as your torch does not mean you can't make beautiful and saleable art beads!
Ventilation is critical. When I first started, I couldn't afford anything, either, so I torched in my garage with the door wide open, a fan on a stand behind me blowing fumes away from my face, and another cheap fan behind the torch pulling fumes away from me. If you can't afford ventilation, be prepared to torch outside on a balcony , garage, or porch until you can. In Georgia, that means a lot of sweating. Don't, please don't, ever try to torch without good ventilation. There are serious health risks.
Furthermore, while every beadmaker is different, plan at least a month and likely much, much more before you can start to sell to get back your investment. if that is indeed a consideration for you. Some people sell after a month; others are just getting into sales after three years. Some never do. That's a LOT of glass. It isn't wasted--you're improving your skills with every bead, success or failure--but it does mean that if you are tight on money that you're going to have to go slowly, and it will be a while before you can begin to regain your investment.
Basically, if you're just getting into this hobby for fun, beaware that it is expensive, and that your improvement may be limited by your pocketbook (i.e. the amount of materials you have available). However, I found that I liked the challenge. I learned to make my own frit, I made my own rod rests out of found material, I scavenged for tools (as long as they are brass, stainless steel, or graphite), I used tiles as marvers (a graphite marver should be on your purchase list--it's easier), I made my own mandrel holders, and the like. While now I am a frit junkie and have some presses and purchased tools, I still use a number of my early "makeshifts." And thinking about what I could use or substitute helped me improve skills.
Whatever you decide, keep us posted, and good luck!
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2007-06-25, 9:07am
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Aug 12, 2006
Location: Benton Arkansas USA
Posts: 2,167
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If you cant afford safty equipment you cant really afford lampwork. Not being mean but it is a must. Your health is more important than learning to make beads. Think it over and maby save money till you can afford it. I had several yard sales and sold lots of jewelry before I started. People on Le are really helpful and want to see you make beads. But not if it harms your health. Dont do something that will hurt you please.I have been in lampwork for over a year now and still havent got my money back. Just now getting good enough to sell to people that really know what they buy. I dont want to sell fugley beads. I want to sell works of art and have fun too.Its fun and if thats what you want start out cheap. But if you want a business you have to spent money. Or your rep. will not be good and you wont get good money for your beads. Good Luck.
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2007-06-25, 12:25pm
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William Hagy
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Join Date: Jan 13, 2007
Location: Spokane,WA
Posts: 415
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I have a friend who just returned from Costa Rica, he mentioned a lampworker there who made glass swans and hummingbirds,and other sculptures. The cost of glass there is so expensive the lampworker was cleaning out flouresent lights after breaking off the ends,then making what he pleased from the glass. ~He longed for a pair of glasses,howeveer he had a torch and simply scraped the coating out of used lights in order to make his sculptures
~Some of us here in the United States do not realize what we have at our finger tips....the resources,economy...stocking 100lbs of color for personal use only to use 3-5 colors on a regular basis.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JakmQ0QIUHs
I hope you are able to find what you need so you too can enjoy the feeling of working with glass.
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50mm & 40mm Herbert Arnold Zenit Burners,Carlisle cc/cc+/mini,Liquid O2.
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2007-06-25, 12:44pm
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Jun 20, 2007
Posts: 545
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thank you Norskiglass
im buying what i can to start.
olther things, i hear all people talking about the keeping propane in the house is so dangerous
well, here in portugal that is very normal, we keep 2 or 3 propane gas tanks, and bigger then the ones you usually use, we use it here for gas heaters and for cooking
so can you explain why is it so dangerous and you always keep it outside
and for ventilation, the gas is what warms the place so the air even smells propane like, so your saying that here in europe we are all killing ourselfs?
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2007-06-25, 12:53pm
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William Hagy
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Join Date: Jan 13, 2007
Location: Spokane,WA
Posts: 415
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I would suggest reading the Safety threads or search propane for many answers to your questions..... This forum is a great place to find information and gain knowlage. ~there is a forum you should check out as well http://www.thegldg.com/forum/index.php
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50mm & 40mm Herbert Arnold Zenit Burners,Carlisle cc/cc+/mini,Liquid O2.
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2007-06-25, 1:00pm
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Life is change. Love it
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Join Date: Oct 10, 2005
Location: Ontario Canada
Posts: 5,566
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It's not so much the propane fumes (althought that would make me sick, I hate the smell), it's the gases released from the glass when it is heated. A chemical soup contaning all sorts of nasties. The one time I torched without ventilation I felt very light headed and had a horrible headache for two days.
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2007-06-25, 2:31pm
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Gentleman of Leisure
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Join Date: Jun 10, 2005
Location: A Little Bit West of Yosemite Valley
Posts: 5,200
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smiltroy
thank you Norskiglass
im buying what i can to start.
olther things, i hear all people talking about the keeping propane in the house is so dangerous
well, here in portugal that is very normal, we keep 2 or 3 propane gas tanks, and bigger then the ones you usually use, we use it here for gas heaters and for cooking
so can you explain why is it so dangerous and you always keep it outside
and for ventilation, the gas is what warms the place so the air even smells propane like, so your saying that here in europe we are all killing ourselfs?
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Pretty much...... Any time you can smell the byproducts of the combustion process, you are breathing in lots of gases that are bad for your health....
Dale
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San Francisco - A Few Toys Short of a Happy Meal
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2007-06-25, 3:03pm
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Jun 20, 2007
Posts: 545
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Dale and about the keeping the propane inside? do you think its ok?
why there is somuch difference in country laws, if one considers danger why do all the other countrys allow it? theres a very big business around propane warms in the winter, and all the houses have the propane for cooking, how can this be?
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2007-06-25, 6:47pm
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Formerly Fireflyartglass
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Join Date: Feb 18, 2006
Location: Canberra, the capital of Australia!
Posts: 791
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IF you are on a hothead YOU CAN MAKE BEADS WITH JUST CLEAR SAFETY GLASSES. You must at least wear clear safety glasses. DO NOT TORCH with nothing over your eyes ! Glass pops and flies and if it went in your eyes you would be going to hospital in an ambulance.
If you havn't bought mandrels your going to be a little lost! You must have mandrels unless you want to make beads without holes which would make them marbles
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On a midrange/minor with bottled oxy!
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2007-06-25, 7:36pm
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Gentleman of Leisure
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Join Date: Jun 10, 2005
Location: A Little Bit West of Yosemite Valley
Posts: 5,200
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smiltroy
Dale and about the keeping the propane inside? do you think its ok?
why there is somuch difference in country laws, if one considers danger why do all the other countrys allow it? theres a very big business around propane warms in the winter, and all the houses have the propane for cooking, how can this be?
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You can do what you want...... I personally keep mine outside!..
Why Europe has different rules I don't know... I do know as a nation of 300,000,000 people we do have laws that cover 98 percent of the country that require it be kept outside a residence for safety reasons...
Here is something to look at and ponder over...
http://www.lampworketc.com/forums/sh...ad.php?t=47331
http://www.lampworketc.com/forums/sh...ad.php?t=48986
You really need to spend more time in SAFETY forum...Reading!
Dale
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San Francisco - A Few Toys Short of a Happy Meal
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