Do glassworking students have any rights?

[Norskiglass]

Originally Posted by MikeAurelius

All that I'm saying here is that it is incumbent on the teacher to inform the student(s) that he/she has not taught very many classes or is teaching a new technique......

That and then some,however I do believe there are numbers of instructors keeping new techniques or innovations back and not offering them in classes.

~I tend to throw a few things in her and there........every so often you may attend a intro to boro bead class with me and come out with blown techs or tube pulls for beads. lol! ~It cost them no extra and leave with more than expected and then some!

[Otter's Flame]

Originally Posted by MikeAurelius

I don't know where this "can't teach if you haven't taught before" is coming from, but its not coming from me. You are putting meaning into my words that is simply not there. Please step back and look at it again.

Yes Mike perhaps I am taking your words:
‘well-qualified’ means people who have taught the same subject before, and are well-known in their field.

and I am reading your words to mean they have to have "taught the same subject BEFORE".

Silly me thinking this means they have to have taught the same subject before. I just don't know how in the world I could have misinterpreted it so incorrectly.

I am not sure how I came up with the incorrect meaning of the word "before". For some bizarre reason in this instance I thought it meant "having occurred previously" boy was I wrong.

So Mike please enlighten me, what does "have taught the same subject before" mean? I think I am having trouble understanding the definition of the word "before".

I know you may be thinking I am a PITA... or worse lol but I am seriously confused and concerned. I am also very curious on what the definition of and by whose standard do you qualify as "well-known in their field".

Otter

[MikeAurelius]

Otter -- no, you are not (yet) a PITA, but you are keeping a very narrow focus, and not taking into account the next sentence. I'm asking that teachers who are either new to teaching or teaching a new technique simply INFORM their students. Period. That's all.

You are completely ignoring the followup sentence, which I highlighted for you. Take one more step back and read that sentence AGAIN. And I'll make it easy for you, I'll quote it once more!!

If the teacher has taught less than 5 classes or is teaching a relatively new technique to him/her, then the teacher must announce this fact prior to taking registration for the class and have written notification in the syllabus information handed out prior to the class.

Are you purposely being dense about this? I dunno...I'm beginning to get that impression. Other people above got it, why not you?

[Otter's Flame]

Mike,
Sorry I cannot be as smart as the "other people above" who "got it". No I am not purposely being dense about it, no matter what your impression may be. I guess I am just dense.

I am not completely ignoring the follow up sentence, I am taking the sentence as a separate one. People who have taught less then 5 classes have still "taught the same subject before" so I do not see it referring to people who have never taught. The sentence does not address people who have not taught before.

If I were on a certification board and someone was up for certification, by your criteria, if they had not taught on the subject before, how could you certify that person? I seriously don't understand that.

Yes I am being narrowly focused on that issue. I have actually sat in on hiring boards where the criteria actually was you had to have "prior teaching experience in the filed of".
I turned down highly qualified candidates because they did not have prior experience teaching others. That is why I have said several times I am glad you started this conversation.... it just seems like your theoretical rules are short sighted. Again yes they are theoretical rules... but you are they one that put them forth.

I still am curious, as I have stated a few times about the criteria of being "well-known in their field".

As far as being a lampworking student I have very little experience. I do know several teachers and several people who have taken classes. With the exception of one teacher, all of them are excellent and absolutely above board. Everyone of them is very consciences about safety and very ethical in what and how they teach. The one person who falls outside that category falls way outside that category. She has a "teaching studio" that has terrible ventilation. I have asked her about it and she blatantly says "ventilation isn't that important". She also says if they want to learn about ventilation they can do that someplace else. This is down right wrong and immoral in my opinion.

I agree these things need to be discussed but I will continue asking for clarification on the issues I am too dense to get. My apologies for not being up to the mental standards of "the people above" who "got it".

Otter

[Norskiglass]

Originally Posted by Otter's Flame

the follow up sentence, I am taking the sentence as a separate one. People who have taught less then 5 classes have still "taught the same subject before" so I do not see it referring to people who have never taught. The sentence does not address people who have not taught before.

In my own experiences with class offerings when I change up a class or offer a different class I will post it as a *New* class so previous student may partake in a little something different. ~Not that I have not taught the techniques before or let alone having the techniques be NEW to me.



[/quote] I still am curious, as I have stated a few times about the criteria of being "well-known in their field". [/quote]

This is an interesting one on me as well and I had a simplistic way of looking at it in regards to "field" (not speaking for Mike) and that is "Teaching Field".

[MikeAurelius]

Otter -- the second sentence is part and parcel of the first. It fills out the definition and is essentially an allowance for those who are "new" at either teaching or at teaching a technique. Without it, they wouldn't be able to teach.

Maybe there should have been a semi-colon there. Would that make it easier for you to understand?

And please, remember, these are IDEAS to be discussed, not some hard and fast thing that is going to be put into practice worldwide in 3 days and no one has any say about it.

I appreciate that you are interested in discussing it, but I think you are putting way too much emotional energy into it.

No one is saying that this is the way it will be. It is merely one idea of a way to resolve some very important issues facing teachers, studios and students.

By having a discussion like this, this idea of mine can be rounded out, the definitions can be made to pretty much everyones liking and perhaps then can be distributed to studios and teachers around the US.

I'm not going to get into a heated debate with you on this -- I'm more interested in everyones ideas and thoughts and to focus in so narrowly is defeating the purpose of the entire thread.

If you like, I'd be happy to have an off-line discussion via e-mail with you about it, you can contact me: mike@auralens.com

Oh, and "taught less than 5 classes": zero is less than 5, so it meets the criteria. Stop being so doggone picky about this. Sheesh!!!

[evolvingBeau]

Otter I don't think mike's picking on you, or saying that you are less intelligent than anyone else here.
Here's my interpretation, Mike you can let me know how I do here..
The statement in question is just asking any teacher-to-be, regardless of experience or notoriety, to be honest and forthright about his or her experience with both the lesson(s) and or skills being taught as well as his or her experience with teaching these things. Eg. whether or not he/she has taught a class before and/or how many..
The intention is not in creating a cut-off that counts out teaching to those whom have not taught before, and it doesn't matter if you are well known or not either.
He's just asking that you share your "credentials" with potential students prior to payment.
If you are self taught, haven't taught a class before, but you have a body of work that creates interest in your techniques enough in forming a class. Then by all means teach one. It's just a matter of letting the students in on these facts prior to sign ups..
Whether or not a first time teacher can provide the proper safety information is another matter that's difficult to police..as is the actual quality in relation to cost of the lesson.
IMO it's just an integral part of spending money, sometimes there is no way to know what you paid for until you get it. That's the beauty of reviews and word of mouth, although even these can't always be trusted as they are generally another individuals opinion that could grossly differ from the one that you would form in the same instance..

[Otter's Flame]

Mike, as I have mentioned several times, I am fully aware these are just ideas "theoretical rules". They are however theoretical rules that you put forward so that is why I am asking you to clarify what I do not understand. Just so you know, I am really not putting much "emotional energy" into this as you have stated. If you feel that asking for clarification is emotional energy, color me guilty.

Originally Posted by MikeAurelius

By having a discussion like this, this idea of mine can be rounded out, the definitions can be made to pretty much everyones liking and perhaps then can be distributed to studios and teachers around the US.

I agree with you, that is why I am participating in this discussion. Trying to get clarification, address concerns, maybe add to the concept if I have anything worthwhile to contribute. That is the way discussions work and that is all I am trying to do. I have no ax to grind with you and as far as I am aware, this isn't a heated debate. Unless you feel me asking you several times for clarification makes it a heated debate. I have not personally attacked you, I have asked for clarification of what you have said but I have at no point even said you were wrong. I don't see this as a heated debate, sorry you do.

Originally Posted by MikeAurelius

Oh, and "taught less than 5 classes": zero is less than 5, so it meets the criteria. Stop being so doggone picky about this. Sheesh!!!

Oh I do agree zero is less than 5, however I was under the impression you cannot teach zero classes..... there would not be a class... and you wouldn't actually be teaching anything to anyone. Once again, silly me.

Otter

[MikeAurelius]

Beau -- YES!!!!!!!!! Precisely.

It is communication.

When this BOR was first developed, there was no allowance for "never taught before" and in discussions with others it was quickly pointed out that there was an "oops" there...and hence the additional sentence. It was felt by all of us who participated in that original discussion that communication was required between teacher and prospective students about the level of experience that the teacher had. As was noted earlier by someone, it was felt that 5-6 classes under the belt of the teacher was a fairly decent number of classes, that by that time the teacher should have a good handle on the material and the rest of the issues.

Otter -- you brough up "well known" -- this wasn't a sticking point in the earlier discussions, but since you think it is, let's discuss it a bit. My thoughts on it were basically that the teacher had his/her name out there, was advertising classes etc. It wasn't meant to be a litmus test for popularity. Maybe it shouldn't even be there, I don't know. I can see an argument either way...

But well-qualified, there are major issues here that certainly need to be addressed. The foremost one in my mind is safety. I'm a firm believer in teaching safety all the time. Even to advanced students, although with advanced students it can be de-emphasized to a certain extent as I believe that there can be a certain assumption that if they have "survived" long enough to be ready for an advanced class, that they are probably (but not guaranteed to be) working safely.

I believe that all teachers should have a thorough understanding of the issues of safety in the studio and be ready to pass them on to their students, and be ready to answer questions in an open and honest way, without taking offense or putting the student down no matter what the question. The issue that Cosmo stated above is a perfect case in point and serves to show that there ARE teachers out there who are either not interested in or not sufficiently educated in eye safety. Several times a week, I get an e-mail or a phone call telling me "I just read your blog (or your website) and my teacher never told me any of this stuff!!"

Well, dayum. That's gotta stop. It just has to.

I certainly don't know how it is going to get enforced. I don't know how a certification program would work. I'm an ideas sort of guy. That's my skill. But I do know this: something needs to happen and soon. I think the very first thing is to get the studios safe. Once we have safe studios, I think teaching safety is going to become a lot easier.

[Norskiglass]

I think this is a great thread and I was a little curious about the "certification" b.s. a guy had cut and paste onto his business cards and printed out last year. It was really strangely worded and "looked" official however upon looking it up I found nothing.

I think that a certification process on various levels would be a great way to get things organized and legitimatize things for the students.

[Just Nancy]

Seems like over kill, but a nice start. Better safe than sorry.

[Cosmo]

Originally Posted by Norskiglass

I think this is a great thread and I was a little curious about the "certification" b.s. a guy had cut and paste onto his business cards and printed out last year. It was really strangely worded and "looked" official however upon looking it up I found nothing.

I think that a certification process on various levels would be a great way to get things organized and legitimatize things for the students.

Yeah, I've seen something similar myself. I was talking with someone and she told me she had taken her beginning classes from a "master lampworker" - the way the instructor introduced themselves to the class. Turns out this person was taught not only improper techniques from this teacher, but dangerous techniques. He was also one of the ones that didn't cover ventilation or eye protection (except to say "put your glasses on"). He also said flame annealing was all that was necessary when making beads.

[Norskiglass]

Originally Posted by Cosmo

Yeah, I've seen something similar myself. I was talking with someone and she told me she had taken her beginning classes from a "master lampworker" - the way the instructor introduced themselves to the class............ .

The Art School here allowed this to happen once and the "Master Class" had demonstrated poor techniques and the instructor had NOT allowed students to work in class. Aside from that the instructor could not produce the work described in the class description only "talk" about it.....sadly none of the students asked for a refund and the school had promoted him.

[lavendar420]

Interesting thread, & pretty spicy for not even being in the woodshed!

I'm interested in this topic because I both teach & take classes.

I teach at a local studio, mostly an intro $99 3 hour class as well as a variety of "next step" classes for those folks who just take classes & never practice. The studio meets my safety requirements - its the place where I torch - sometimes for over 5 hours at a stretch. I talk about the various safety precautions at the studio & provide a hand out of websites & books for more info - home setup info is not part of the class. The ISBG outline seems like material for 4 or 5 classes - I can't imagine covering all that in 3 hours, let alone getting some torch time in there!

Anyways, I also take classes at higher price points on a regular basis. Some of those classes have not met my expectations for ventilation, but I figure its only for a limited time once or twice a year so I can cope. Classes in a non studio temporary setting just aren't going to have a ventilation in take for every torch. They may have a big box fan in the open door, and frequent student breaks for fresh air. If I signed up for such a class (not knowing about the improper ventilation) & had a reaction like what Haley described, I would probably not want to continue in the class & expect at least a partial refund.

Safety info is rarely addressed in any of the higher end classes - & I would probably be annoyed if much time was spent on it - I'm there to learn techniques & stuff. If a class is covering enamels or fuming, its good to touch on the ventilation requirements, but I don't want to hear a discourse on all the scientific data of why.

Comprehensive safety info seems out of scope for an intro type class - just too much info to really address at the level newbies should have. I know my students pretty much start to glaze over at 20 mins of talking. I honestly think that topics like the full on "hows" of proper studio ventilation are best left for a later date - as long as they know that ventilation is necessary & a fan in the window won't cut it.

I can't imagine a class purely on safety being all that popular, either - most of us would probably rather spend the money on something more fun. Hand outs are an easy solution, I guess, & hopefully people read them.

Safety aside, I think there are very different expectations & needs for different levels of classes. Rank newbies don't need to take a $500 class from a brand name teacher - good on them if they do want to support the artist & all but it's not all that necessary. Those of us who are at a place where we have a list of folks we want to take classes from, we want those spots! lol.

I'm actually quite surprised to hear that Arrow Springs doesn't have adequate ventilation. That's just silly - they need to get that figured out.

There. that was my very rambling post. carry on

[Otter's Flame]

Norski, I wish the term "flame annealing" had never been born. I was at a show one time and there was another glass bead maker there. He had been making beads for a grand total of about 6 months. He took an "advanced" class and was telling me all about it. He didn't realize I was there selling beads also. I asked about annealing... lol I am terrible but I like to do that. He told me that in the "advanced" class he learned "flame annealing". He did tell me that some day he did plan to get a kiln. Nice! And he was selling his beads??? Helllooooo!!! "Flame annealing" and "I torch with a window open" are two of my pet peeves.

Otter

[Cosmo]

Originally Posted by lavendar420

I teach at a local studio, mostly an intro $99 3 hour class as well as a variety of "next step" classes for those folks who just take classes & never practice. The studio meets my safety requirements - its the place where I torch - sometimes for over 5 hours at a stretch. I talk about the various safety precautions at the studio & provide a hand out of websites & books for more info - home setup info is not part of the class. The ISBG outline seems like material for 4 or 5 classes - I can't imagine covering all that in 3 hours, let alone getting some torch time in there!

That's something I wish could be addressed. Now, I know that not everyone can work on the torch all the time. I'm not badmouthing anyone for that. But, I have taught at a national show the past two years teaching intermediate level classes, and each time I have had more than a few people who tell me "I took a class here last year, but I haven't done any glass since then". This year I'm teaching an advanced level hollow bead class, and I know I'll get more of the same. I wish there was some way to pre-screen students or something.

Or, I wish there was some way to really stress to students how important it is for them to be honest with their level before taking a class. This class in particular is the most advanced class I teach, and I'm afraid that when I teach it I'll have a lot of inexperienced people that will make me go back and teach them things they should already know...

[Norskiglass]

Originally Posted by Otter's Flame

Norski, I wish the term "flame annealing" had never been born.

It tends to be miss-used,miss-interpreted,and other wise overlooked.... what I dont like it to hear people ask: "why did it crack in the kiln!?!? And what amuses me the most is I just gave a number out for a used kiln to a woman who has done spun glass sculptures for 30yrs.

She never once annealed one single thing over all those years.......how do you think she did that?

[evolvingBeau]

Originally Posted by Cosmo

That's something I wish could be addressed. Now, I know that not everyone can work on the torch all the time. I'm not badmouthing anyone for that. But, I have taught at a national show the past two years teaching intermediate level classes, and each time I have had more than a few people who tell me "I took a class here last year, but I haven't done any glass since then". This year I'm teaching an advanced level hollow bead class, and I know I'll get more of the same. I wish there was some way to pre-screen students or something.

Or, I wish there was some way to really stress to students how important it is for them to be honest with their level before taking a class. This class in particular is the most advanced class I teach, and I'm afraid that when I teach it I'll have a lot of inexperienced people that will make me go back and teach them things they should already know...

I'd be curious to know how the hollow bead class goes Cosmo...have you taught one before?
A blown boro bead class(probably what you're talking about) is what people have been asking me about teaching and I have alot of concerns about the learning curve.
Even the most advanced mandrel bead artist would possibly struggle with tubing at first. Are you going to have pre-requisites for tube working experience or just say it's advanced? There is so much more minutia with tube work that it seems like it would be a real challenge to convey in order for the students to go home with a feeling of accomplishment and progression and a piece that they can be proud of.

[Otter's Flame]

Originally Posted by Norskiglass

She never once annealed one single thing over all those years.......how do you think she did that?

Uhhhhhhhhh Elfen Magic??

Otter

[Norskiglass]

Originally Posted by Otter's Flame

Uhhhhhhhhh Elfen Magic??

~and for some reason Parramore's name just popped into my mind.

[pam]

I think what everyone has to remember is that things were done a bit differently a few years back - let's say 10, 15 years ago - not so very long. I know when I first started in the Eighties there was no annealing mentioned anywhere. I didn't learn anything about annealing until around Ninety. Ventilation? Never knew it was important until the Gathering in Corning when ISGB had NIOSH come and do tests. This is a relatively new studio art form and there have been so many technological advances in the last 10 or 15 years that it is totally amazing.

Whenever I talk to some of the older glassworkers I find that many of the boro people never annealed their smaller work, especially if it was blown or spun glass. Most of these people knew nothing about ventilation or protective lenses. I know a glassworker who worked for over 30 years with no ventilation or protective lenses, and very little annealing. I think we have to give some respect to those, like the woman doing spun glass, as they are from a different generation of glassworkers. Some of those I would consider "masters" from Italy and elsewhere never had ventilation, although I think they have always annealed. As has been brought up several times here on LE and other places, some people, predominantly at this time in other countries, believe they don't need to anneal beads. Flame annealing is a term from long ago that has lost its meaning in this day and age. I believe people cling to the term as a way of avoiding the expense of a kiln. However, as we all know, ventilation is important and annealing is important and proper handling of our gas is important, and to add to that, education for the public and for glassworkers everywhere is important. Yes, we have to stand up and say what we have learned as the correct parameters for working glass, but I think we have to do it with respect for those who legitimately believe we are wrong.

[Norskiglass]

Originally Posted by pam

I think what everyone has to remember is that things were done a bit differently a few years back <snip> I think we have to give some respect to those, like the woman doing spun glass, as they are from a different generation of glassworkers. Some of those I would consider "masters" from Italy and elsewhere never had ventilation, Flame annealing is a term from long ago.......

~your post has put things in a better perspective for those whom had never had the exposure or understanding.

[Cosmo]

Originally Posted by evolvingBeau

I'd be curious to know how the hollow bead class goes Cosmo...have you taught one before?
A blown boro bead class(probably what you're talking about) is what people have been asking me about teaching and I have alot of concerns about the learning curve.
Even the most advanced mandrel bead artist would possibly struggle with tubing at first. Are you going to have pre-requisites for tube working experience or just say it's advanced? There is so much more minutia with tube work that it seems like it would be a real challenge to convey in order for the students to go home with a feeling of accomplishment and progression and a piece that they can be proud of.

Well, it's a two day class. On day one we are going to be doing coil-potted beads and beads on the outside of tubing. I'm going to pre-pull a bunch of points and allow people to use them, but also demonstrate pulling points and allow them to try it themselves. Day two will be all inside-out beads.

I've taught all of these before, but never together in one class. I teach inside-out beads here two or three times a year. I have taught it much more in a non-beadmaking setting as well. Of course students struggle at first, but I have a few tips that I show them to help things along. I haven't taught coil potting as much, but that's pretty easy to catch on to.

And, like all of my classes, I will stress that "the technique is more important than the finished product". I make sure they know that the purpose of the class is not to leave with the most beautiful piece they have ever seen, but to leave with the skills involved to make beautiful pieces.

[evolvingBeau]

It definitely once was a much more intuitive artform...Much like many artisan trades of old, like brewing and baking were not understood on a molecular level..but the old artisans are the ones that figured out how to malt grains beer and bake bread in the first place..
After the real hard work of discovery and invention is done, modern day artisans take the fruits and easily use and improve upon them, it's not a bad place to be, now techniques, etc. are like wildflowers, everywhere and often free.
You can't blame the old school pros for doing it "the way it was always done before them".
I wonder if the flowers made by Leopold and Rudolf Blaschka were flame annealed..I bet they were. They're still intact over 100 years later..
Defintely respect is deserved by those whom didn't have the multitude of resources, books and forums that are available today.

[evolvingBeau]

Originally Posted by Cosmo

"the technique is more important than the finished product". I make sure they know that the purpose of the class is not to leave with the most beautiful piece they have ever seen, but to leave with the skills involved to make beautiful pieces.

Sounds good to me. Pulling points for the class is probably a good idea. Some could waste alot of time (and glass) getting that right. Would make it more fun..
That's a good quote for a blown bead class to be sure.

[Norskiglass]

Originally Posted by Cosmo

Well, it's a two day class. On day one we are going to be doing coil-potted beads and beads on the outside of tubing.

I have tossed in coil pot beads on mandrel and off in intro classes and most students have picked them up in a snap.....others not so well depending on experiance,etc... I stressed heat control and working on a smaller scale at first yet there seems to be the inevitable that they try coil potting up two 18" rods.

Hope the class goes well for you.

[Just Nancy]

I think there is a difference between annealing and working in front of an open window. One provides an usafe end product one likely harms the artist (not knowing the rest of the room).

I find it sad that known artists command their price no matter where they teach and other (informed) 'starting out' teachers some how feel they can't start until they have the right background, title or certification.

I think it is more about each person deciding where they are willing to teach and each student deciding what they can afford. Hopefully sites like ISGB, LE, TAM, and otehrs plus personal sites will continue to educate about safety.

[pam]

You know, Nancy, what you say makes some sense. Yes, I agree that it is more about "each person deciding where they are willing to teach and each student deciding what they can afford," although I'm not sure the cost of a class has much to do with the environment. However, I go back to the premise that the "protection" for students should be more important for beginning classes than more advanced classes. Students who know nothing have to be protected, and have to be informed why. More advanced students should know enough to ask questions before they go into a classroom situation, or analyze the situation while they are there and walk away if it is unsafe.

I have taught classes since the early Nineties. If I told you what we instructors did back then for safety, you would be horrified. There were very few classes being taught anywhere in the US, so if there were enough people interested in a class, usually a stained glass shop or art center would make room for a class. No great ventilation, but fire extinguishers were always in evidence.

Things have changed over the years and now I think it is incumbent upon a beginning instructor to stress to the venues where they are asked to teach the type of safety precautions that should be in place. For a one-time class I wouldn't expect the venue owner to put in a ventilation system that could cost thousands of dollars, but I would expect there to be fresh air, fans to move the air in and out of the area, provide fire extinguishers and a way to have the propane tanks outside. I would expect the instructor to demand these things and monitor the atmosphere within the classroom to determine the quality of the air. That can be as simple as going outside for a few minutes to breathe fresh air and coming back in and using your nose to determine if there is that certain smell that means the presence of NOx. If there is that certain smell, then the class needs to take a break until the smell has dissipated, and the instructor needs to educate the students about what he is doing and why. Now, I know that all the safety gurus are going to disagree with me, but I think everyone has to start somewhere. In many places classes are still non-existent. People have to be educated, and you can't educate them if you make so many rules that it's impossible to have a class.

In a perfect world we instructors would be able to teach only in venues that provide perfect ventilation, etc., but the fact of the matter is that that is not going to happen all the time. So, what we need to do is educate instructors about what is a good substitute for a one-time class, how we can educate the owners of the facility about the actual needs if they wish to continue with classes, and we have to educate the students about the need for safety in their own environment should they wish to set up a studio in their own home.

Once again, education is key.

[Norskiglass]

Pam, I must say your work is quite beautiful and I may ad that by having not met you we both have been faced with similar levels of teaching in studios lacking ventilation,etc...

I made a choice to no longer participate in the "one-time" teaching environment for reasons of my own and first and foremost the students safety. It has been very rewarding over the years teaching lampwork glass and I do have to say I really would not be teaching today if it had not been a job offer via a local art school.

I side with the fact things have gone a long way in the past 10-15yrs and I would like to see instructors such as myself on the level within a certification program or otherwise to prevent further problems with heath and safety being overlooked in the studio or miss-information to students about ventilation and or inhalation/exposure issues.

[pam]

I think the idea of certification is great, however in practice, how does it happen? This has been looked at for many years, not only within ISGB, but other organizations - as long as I can remember. However, it all comes back to who is going to judge and more importantly, what are they going to judge to give certification.

You can give a written test to potential instructors that encompasses safety, knowledge of glass, knowledge of annealing procedures, etc. Can you give a test that says this person is a good teacher? And once the test is given and a certificate of whatever is issued, the question becomes, what does the person do when he/she walks out the door? What happens as the years pass and more knowledge is gained? Do you retest, recall the certification? Do you investigate complaints by a student?

The same thing can be said for studio certification. Assuming that you come up with standards and you hire someone with the type of equipment necessary to test a studio, and assume that the studio passes the test and receives the certification, what happens when the tester walks out the door? What happens 2 years down the road when a studio is certified safe and the ventilation system stops functioning perfectly? What happens when further knowledge brings us information that requires more stringent requirements? Does the certifying agency then have to turn around and up the requirements, retest, recall the certification? There are agencies with more money than God that can do these types of things, but I don't know of a glass-related organization or agency that has the unlimited funds to police things once certification is given. So, the question becomes, what value does certification have?

There are some possibilities here. You could certify instructors for a one-year period, a two-year period. a 5-year period, whatever. You could require continuing education credits. You could certify according to soft glass or boro, blown or mandrel-wound beads, small sculpture, large sculpture. You could certify studios once a year, once every two years. Would the studio receive a certification according to torch size, because the ventilation system may be valid for 8 small torches, but what about 8 gigantic torches? How about fuming, use of toxic sprays, etc.

Do we want to be in the business of policing flameworkers? Do we issue a warrant for arrest should a person teach a class in a place that does not live up to whatever standards are established? I think having standards for studios and instructors is important. I think educating those studios and instructors is important. I also think it's equally important to educate the students as to what to look for when seeking a class.