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  #121  
Old 2010-09-22, 11:13am
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ah, just read your post. I say do it and don't bother to check here first
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  #122  
Old 2010-09-22, 11:14am
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It IS a good idea. I also think that if a few tut authors got together with their tuts, they might be able to approach a major publisher about compiling them into a book. They would almost certainly not make much money on it, but they would have publication credit and it would be an opportunity for them to become more widely known.
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  #123  
Old 2010-09-22, 11:18am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kalera View Post
It IS a good idea. I also think that if a few tut authors got together with their tuts, they might be able to approach a major publisher about compiling them into a book. They would almost certainly not make much money on it, but they would have publication credit and it would be an opportunity for them to become more widely known.
I sell mine in book form. The cost is not anywhere near what you would expect.
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  #124  
Old 2010-09-22, 11:19am
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Originally Posted by Cosmo View Post
Yeah. I was going to do it. When I initially talked about the site, I was just trying to see if there was enough interest to go through with it. I hadn't looked at the numbers to see what it would cost or anything. People asked me if it would cost them anything to list, and I said no, but when they sold a tutorial the site would take a certain percentage. Somewhere I threw out 10% as an example and said that that was just a random percentage I came up with, and that I hadn't done the math.

Everyone got all up in arms and said that 10% was way too much and that I was trying to steal from everyone. I replied that 10% was just a random number, and I didn't know how much the actual percentage was, and that I was just trying to see if anyone was interested.

But, nobody could get past that I said 10% and kept harping on how that was too much of a percentage (again, I said at least 5 times that 10% was not the actual number - it was just a number I threw out there as an example). I even mentioned a couple times that I wasn't trying to get rich and that I was only going to charge enough to cover my expenses. But, nobody was able to get past "10%". They wouldn't let it go and I got tired of being accused of stealing and replying to PM's having to defend myself, so I dropped the idea.

Truth be told, I still think it's a good idea. I'm not about to revisit the idea of making it happen though.
It is a good idea, but I understand you not wanting to revisit the idea.

Last year I tried to organize some people to do a real online selling site (no effin' commercial supplies... no effin' vintage crap...)... but I don't have the energy, time, or money to do it myself and although there was/is a HUGE need for such a site, the project fell by the wayside due to several different issues. So yeah, I can relate about "it's a good idea, but not worth the stress".
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  #125  
Old 2010-09-22, 11:21am
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Originally Posted by Cosmo View Post
I sell mine in book form. The cost is not anywhere near what you would expect.
My book will hopefully be complete by the end of the year but I'm still unsure if I want to do ebook or hardcopy. Which route did you go?
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  #126  
Old 2010-09-22, 11:22am
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Originally Posted by Cosmo View Post
I sell mine in book form. The cost is not anywhere near what you would expect.
I'm talking about going to a major publisher so that the book would be available through mainstream outlets, for greater exposure more than for money.

I do prefer tuts in book form, and wish more people would go to that format. I'd be more likely to buy a hardcopy bound book than a .pdf file.
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  #127  
Old 2010-09-22, 11:22am
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Originally Posted by Laura B View Post
It is a good idea, but I understand you not wanting to revisit the idea.

Last year I tried to organize some people to do a real online selling site (no effin' commercial supplies... no effin' vintage crap...)... but I don't have the energy, time, or money to do it myself and although there was/is a HUGE need for such a site, the project fell by the wayside due to several different issues. So yeah, I can relate about "it's a good idea, but not worth the stress".
For me, it actually wouldn't have been that much work. I set up sites like that all the time. It was really only a matter of registering the domain name, spending a few hours setting it up, and then promoting it.

But, again, it wasn't well received.

And, yes, I do know that there are plenty of people who work with glass that don't visit this board, but 99% of the tutorials out there that I've found have been created by people who visit this board. Figuring that those would be my "customers" who would provide the items for sale, and those same people being the ones giving me such a hard time, I figured it best I just drop it.
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  #128  
Old 2010-09-22, 11:24am
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Originally Posted by Kalera View Post
I'm talking about going to a major publisher so that the book would be available through mainstream outlets, for greater exposure more than for money.

I do prefer tuts in book form, and wish more people would go to that format. I'd be more likely to buy a hardcopy bound book than a .pdf file.
They can be made available through mainstream outlets without going through a publisher. I'm in the process of making my books available on Amazon right now.

It wouldn't be much more work to get them in Borders and Barnes & Noble. But, it's no secret that book stores are on the way out. In five years there probably won't be any more book stores. So, I didn't bother trying to get hooked up with them.
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  #129  
Old 2010-09-22, 11:37am
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The advantage of publishing through a large press is almost purely that they do the promotion, and already have an audience of millions that they can expose your book to, which if why it would be an advantage to some artists to have their tuts published that way. In terms of actually making a profit selling them, rather than in terms of getting exposure as an artist, self-publishing is probably more profitable in this field.
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  #130  
Old 2010-09-22, 12:05pm
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Cosmo, I bet if you did the numbers and came up with the real percentage, people would see how affordable it was. I'd love to be able to buy from a site like that.
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  #131  
Old 2010-09-22, 12:12pm
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Anouk said:
"I'm in this world to learn and develop myself and I really appreciate all the efforts anyone takes to help me achieve that. For free or for money." I love this! Thanks, Anouk, for saying it so eloquently~

As a writer of tuts about how to make your own tools, I really appreciate hearing people's feelings and insights on the specific point about disclosing all requirements of a tut (and I sure was relieved when I figured out LauraB wasn't talking about me)! I do want to know if anybody is unhappy with my tuts after they buy them, and a few people have taken the time to write helpful comments. Sometimes I can point them to the answer, and a couple of people have pointed out things I needed to clarify in the text. I am grateful for that!

For my tuts, disclosure of the exact supplies and components would absolutely compromise the tutorial, but I hope I've never ignored anyone who asked a question about the requirements. For instance, on the last tut, I got questions like "will I have to know how to weld?" and "how much will the tools and supplies cost me?" Specific questions like that really help me, because I can easily answer them directly. (By the way, NO, you don't have to weld, and supplies for the mandrels are less than $2, and the mandrels can be constructed with basic household hand tools ~ pliers, screwdriver, etc).

Each different tutorial is so specific, I think it's pretty hard to make general statements about what the tutorial author ought to be doing/saying, or what they ought to be able to share about the tut with potential customers. My philosophy is, the more I can tell you ahead of time, the better you'll be able to evaluate if the tut will work for you. And I think "how much is it going to cost me to do what is described in this tutorial?" is always a reasonable question.

Did I mention how much I appreciate everyone's comments and insights in this thread? I will definitely have them in mind as I start working on my third tutorial. Thanks!


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  #132  
Old 2010-09-22, 12:27pm
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... (and I sure was relieved when I figured out LauraB wasn't talking about me)...
I really want to emphasize that I'm saying it was MY fault for not understanding what the tutorial was about prior to buying it (and relying on what a previous customer said... which turned out not to be true).

This was NOT the fault of the tutorial author. If she doesn't want to list the tools involved, that's her perogative. And as a buyer, it was MY choice to purchase it knowing nothing about the tools needed to use the tutorial (again, other than listening to a previous customer).
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  #133  
Old 2010-09-22, 12:29pm
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... And I think "how much is it going to cost me to do what is described in this tutorial?" is always a reasonable question...
Me too. But that makes me a more careful buyer in the future is all.
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  #134  
Old 2010-09-22, 2:53pm
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Let's just remember that we tend to read a "tone" into something that is ours and not necessarily at all what the writer intended.
Yes it is true, I've noticed that. Snarky people make out like everybody is snarky and mean spirited...or filled with an agenda.....it goes on and on. I believe the advice was given freely and with the best intentions. But that isn't the popular opinion it seems.
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  #135  
Old 2010-09-22, 3:06pm
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Yes it is true, I've noticed that. Snarky people make out like everybody is snarky and mean spirited...or filled with an agenda.....it goes on and on. I believe the advice was given freely and with the best intentions. But that isn't the popular opinion it seems.
I think that's taking it a bit far... I think that when we are feeling sensitive, in a bad mood, or something is a tender subject, sometimes we read a tone into things that isn't what the author intended.
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  #136  
Old 2010-09-22, 9:14pm
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I think it's imperative to have one or two people read over your tutorial before publishing to look for spelling errors and grammar errors. I had four people read over mine. I also asked them to read it and to tell me if anything didn't make sense or wasn't worded right. After making corrections from their feedback, I then went over the entire tutorial one last time and I still found a few errors. After releasing it one person emailed me on day two to tell me about one little error... Now if anyone knows of one that's left just don't even tell me. My trial ran out on the software I used so I couldn't fix it anyway.
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  #137  
Old 2010-09-22, 9:20pm
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In all this, it has to be said that there is quite a lot of skill that goes into making these tutorials! Not just writing them and the knowledge of glass bead making. So much hinges on the quality of your photographs too!!! In my tutorial, Easy Bellflowers, I took all your advice to heart but it too a long time to create all the graphics that I used and to take some good photos to go with my writing. I just hope that people can apprieciate all that goes into it. It helps that my day job is as a Medical Photographer so I use to creating instructional photographs and diagrams!

Cheers

Jenny
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  #138  
Old 2010-09-23, 7:50am
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In all this, it has to be said that there is quite a lot of skill that goes into making these tutorials! ...
Exactly.

Both my kids have been in hockey since they were nine years old and one of the most important things I've learned is that just because someone's really good at PLAYING hockey doesn't meant they're suited to COACH hockey.

I think tutorial writing is a skill that can be very separate from whatever it is you're talking about. Some have that skill, some don't.

But everyone can try to learn things to improve.
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  #139  
Old 2010-09-23, 8:41am
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After releasing it one person emailed me on day two to tell me about one little error... Now if anyone knows of one that's left just don't even tell me. My trial ran out on the software I used so I couldn't fix it anyway.
Amy, if you have a 2nd email addy, delete all cookies on your computer related to the software site (and delete the trial software). Sign up on the software site again with a different email... It should work.
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  #140  
Old 2010-09-23, 8:53am
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Amy, if you have a 2nd email addy, delete all cookies on your computer related to the software site (and delete the trial software). Sign up on the software site again with a different email... It should work.
I tried that long ago along with a bunch of other tricks...it didn't work.
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  #141  
Old 2010-09-23, 8:57am
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Each different tutorial is so specific, I think it's pretty hard to make general statements about what the tutorial author ought to be doing/saying, or what they ought to be able to share about the tut with potential customers.
Jo
Very TRUE!

All I was trying to say is... care about the writing as much as you* care about the project. The tutorial is a product for your company / brand / studio as much as the physical items (beads, tools, whatever you are known for) you sell are. Both represent you / your name. Be as picky about the tut as you would be about the bead... And since most of us are NOT writers by trade...just have someone look it over. That only serves to make you look better in the end.


---*You is a general word and not intended to point out to any one person in particular.
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  #142  
Old 2010-09-23, 10:20am
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Holly, I apologize for my knee-jerk response. As always, I should have filtered my replies until I wasn't as upset.

For the record, I am aware that what you wrote wasn't directed specifically at me. I included myself in your sweeping generalizations because you addressed your article to tutorial writers...which I am. Why wouldn't I have included myself?

Also for the record, I never attacked anyone. I never said anything negative about another person. Strongly defended my own position- yes. Attack someone else- no.

You are entitled to your perceptions as I am entitled to mine.

"care about the writing as much as you care about the project"...absolutely. Spot on. Have someone look it over. Spot on.

My opinion is still the same as before, but I regret being so aggressive about it. You couldn't have known my motivations or goals and it stung that you had them wrong, but you were going by your own personal experience which I wasn't a part of.

Peace out.
~~Mary
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  #143  
Old 2010-09-23, 10:21am
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Very TRUE!

All I was trying to say is... care about the writing as much as you* care about the project. The tutorial is a product for your company / brand / studio as much as the physical items (beads, tools, whatever you are known for) you sell are. Both represent you / your name. Be as picky about the tut as you would be about the bead... And since most of us are NOT writers by trade...just have someone look it over. That only serves to make you look better in the end.


---*You is a general word and not intended to point out to any one person in particular.

Very true. I have a very casual, folksy kind of demeanor in my writing, but that's representative of me. So to lose that... to become very pithy, articulate , and professional-sounding may in fact deter some of the very people I want to reach with my work.

I try to keep my writing true to who I am. This does not mean I approve of sloppy writing and/or grammar errors, etc. It merely means whereas someone else may get right to the point, I prefer to hold the reader's hand... and I inject some of my personality into the tutorial, fully realizing that's not everyone's cup of tea.

But I am a firm believer in staying true to your individual personality.
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  #144  
Old 2010-09-23, 10:22am
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Holly, I apologize for my knee-jerk response. As always, I should have filtered my replies until I wasn't as upset...
Ha! If we all did that, LE would be such a different place.

But I know what you mean 'cause I do the same thing. *sigh*
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  #145  
Old 2010-09-23, 11:58am
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Originally Posted by Laura B View Post
Very true. I have a very casual, folksy kind of demeanor in my writing, but that's representative of me. So to lose that... to become very pithy, articulate , and professional-sounding may in fact deter some of the very people I want to reach with my work.

I try to keep my writing true to who I am. This does not mean I approve of sloppy writing and/or grammar errors, etc. It merely means whereas someone else may get right to the point, I prefer to hold the reader's hand... and I inject some of my personality into the tutorial, fully realizing that's not everyone's cup of tea.

But I am a firm believer in staying true to your individual personality.
Laura B.. once again (IMNSHO) I believe that you have been spot on here (in so many ways) and that your contribution to this thread has not only been elegantly put and very relevant, but also beyond reproach.

Further, I think that the perspective you've shared has been like a fresh and strong cross breeze blowing throughout the bulk of the issues debated in this thread...

I'm no expert (well, not a verified one, at any rate ;} ..but my strong response to what you've brought to the table here is *KUDOS*!

...personally I'd like to thank you for your point of view and for your diplomacy!

~Rachel
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  #146  
Old 2010-09-24, 6:55am
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Holly'sFolly Holly'sFolly is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Laura B View Post
This does not mean I approve of sloppy writing and/or grammar errors, etc. It merely means whereas someone else may get right to the point, I prefer to hold the reader's hand... and I inject some of my personality into the tutorial, fully realizing that's not everyone's cup of tea.
I, LOVE when the writer's personality shows through. But, you can allow your personality to show and still use correct spelling and grammar.

I often write in my own Southern vernacular. (I'm sorry but there IS no better word for Ya'll! Unless I'm writing for a larger group... then it's all ya'll!)

But as an editor, when I see someone who repeatedly uses phrases like

other then

your gonna

supposably

irregardless

...MY EYES BLEED! And yes, I make a judgment about whether or not I would buy their WRITTEN product. A bead yes; a tut NO! I know I will never get past the bad writing to enjoy the tut... And this is from someone who LOVES reading about glass! (Whether or not I ever try to make the bead in the tut!)
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  #147  
Old 2010-09-24, 8:01am
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Laura B Laura B is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Holly'sFolly View Post
I, LOVE when the writer's personality shows through. But, you can allow your personality to show and still use correct spelling and grammar...
Which is precisely what I said.
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  #148  
Old 2010-09-24, 9:14am
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Holly'sFolly Holly'sFolly is offline
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Right... I was agreeing WITH you...
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  #149  
Old 2010-09-25, 7:02am
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KJJames KJJames is offline
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I've been hesitant to reply in this thread because I wasn't really sure how to say what I was thinking, but another thread has helped give me a start. The other thread asks what your favorite saying is and I think one of mine is applicable here.

Holly, "It's not what you say, but how you say it."

As I have read through this thread, it seems that most people agree with a lot of what you posted in your blog. The problem came with how you addressed yourself. I do not write tutorials, but when I read it I thought you came off with a bit too much authority. Your tone to me was not as someone who had experience and wanted to offer assistance, but as someone who knew better and was going to let others know what they were doing wrong. I think you could have approached things in a smoother way.

As for the work you did with HGTV, well I don't think that is comparing apples to apples. I did watch the Carol Duvall show and I did refer to some of the "cheat sheets" that were on the web site. While I enjoy many of the segments, if I paid to purchase any of them individually as a DVD or if I paid $10 - $20 for any of the "cheat sheets" on the web site, I would not be a happy person. They just did not provide enough information. Not like the information provided by the tutorial writers I have purchased from here on LE.

I like lots of information. I like knowing about the author. I am more than satisfied with what I have purchased.

Again Holly, you had some good things to say. You just could have found a better way to say it.
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  #150  
Old 2010-09-28, 12:26pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kalera View Post
I think that's taking it a bit far... I think that when we are feeling sensitive, in a bad mood, or something is a tender subject, sometimes we read a tone into things that isn't what the author intended.
Hmmmm..........I think your assessment is much truer than mine. I stand corrected.
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