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  #1  
Old 2008-06-02, 6:20am
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Default Boro Marbles Layered Petals

Hi Everybody,

I have been trying to figure out the floral marbles on my own. I was hoping to take a class with John Kobuki but I wasn't able to... So I am still perplexed about how to get layers in a floral marble. For instance, on a pansy so it looks like one petal is behind the others if you know what I mean. I suspect it has to do with laying down some petals and imploding a little and then adding more petals and imploding more. But I just did a flower like that - put down the outer petals and imploded a bit, then put down the inner petals and imploded a bit, then added the stamens and finished the imploding...and it actually looks flatter and the petals more closely layered than when I just lay all the petals and stamen down at once and implode. Hope I'm making sense with this explanation... Anybody have any ideas? I am also working on butterflies and the body, antenna and head seem to float above the wings - I don't want them to implode too much I guess so I am thinking maybe I should add them last after imploding the wings a bit??

Thanks for your insight!!

Sandy
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  #2  
Old 2008-06-02, 7:28am
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i usually put down the color all at once (except for butterflies) leaving clear space between them. then when imploding making sure there is enough hot glass on the feed rod for it to have somewhere to go, if its cool on top it flattens to much to the sides. i have also added lines for petals after imploding a bit, gives a bit of a different effect. i cant wait to take a kobuki class too!
ro
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  #3  
Old 2008-06-02, 8:09am
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Hi Ro,

What do you do with the butterflies? Which part do you add later??

Sandy
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  #4  
Old 2008-06-02, 8:45am
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I lay them down in separate steps. First layer of petals, implode, stamen, implode, second layer of petals, implode, leaves, implode. Each step I only push it on the marver gently once or maybe twice before the next step. Also, be sure to keep the top glass hot so you don't flatten it when you are pushing it in. HTH .

ETA: I forgot to add that in my pendants I've found that adding the leaves at the same time as the second petal layer makes them a bit more visible but on marbles I usually do them in a separate step. Also wanted to add that I learned how to make flowers from a class with Sabina Boehm. She's fantastic and worth every penny if she teaches near you!
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Last edited by DawnT; 2008-06-02 at 8:54am.
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  #5  
Old 2008-06-02, 7:32pm
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What do you mean by keeping the top glass hot? I'm very new to this but when I do any implosion, which I'd assume the flowers would be, I try to keep the heat right on the "tread" of the maria. I have been using the top minor of my torch for this and I still get the rod holding the piece heated to the point of it becoming floppy.
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  #6  
Old 2008-06-02, 8:03pm
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I did a Kobuki class eaRLIER THIS YEAR. wHAT A GREAT TEACHER, AND ALL AROUND SWEET HUMAN BEING. To bad he got so sick while he was here and ended up in the hospital, so I only got part of the class. But he was very generous with giving me notes on the things I missed out on. Cant wait till he comes back again. Well worth every penny for a clas with him.

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  #7  
Old 2008-06-02, 9:07pm
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Originally Posted by Howie View Post
What do you mean by keeping the top glass hot? I'm very new to this but when I do any implosion, which I'd assume the flowers would be, I try to keep the heat right on the "tread" of the maria. I have been using the top minor of my torch for this and I still get the rod holding the piece heated to the point of it becoming floppy.
I just mean that if the top of your maria isn't hot enough the glass won't implode upward into it but rather it will flatten out where it hits the cold glass above.
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  #8  
Old 2008-06-02, 10:39pm
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Let me preface this by saying I am NOT the queen of implosions

BUT...when you do an implosion, you want the whole maria hot. Yes, you want the heat directed mostly at the "treads", but the whole thing needs to be hot to prevent the divot in the bottom and also to prevent the dreaded "smooshed" implosion. Basically, if the whole thing isn't hot enough, it won't work right. For this reason, when I do an implosion, I use a pretty big rod to make my maria...at least 15mm for a average size pendant. This prevents the whole thing from wanting to flop around on the rod.

As far as flowers, the lines that are laid down closest to the rim are the ones furthest in the back when it implodes, so the lines laid down closest to the middle will be in the foreground and the lines around the rim will be in the background. Finally figured that out after experimenting a bit last year from total curiosity Hope that helps!!
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Old 2008-06-03, 5:04am
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Originally Posted by DawnT View Post
I lay them down in separate steps. First layer of petals, implode, stamen, implode, second layer of petals, implode, leaves, implode. Each step I only push it on the marver gently once or maybe twice before the next step. Also, be sure to keep the top glass hot so you don't flatten it when you are pushing it in. HTH .

ETA: I forgot to add that in my pendants I've found that adding the leaves at the same time as the second petal layer makes them a bit more visible but on marbles I usually do them in a separate step. Also wanted to add that I learned how to make flowers from a class with Sabina Boehm. She's fantastic and worth every penny if she teaches near you!

Sorry to be so thick... but which petals do you lay down first - the ones on the inside or the outside?? I really appreciate these tips!

Sandy
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  #10  
Old 2008-06-03, 6:21am
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Sorry to be so thick... but which petals do you lay down first - the ones on the inside or the outside?? I really appreciate these tips!

Sandy
Start from the inside and work towards the outside. The key to getting a deep implosion is to get the clear really, really hot.

When you marver it, do so very gently. That will keep the petals straight up and down. Then once you get everything in there, get it hot and press it a little harder, and that will make it "bloom". You want to keep the petals straight up and down until the last minute, otherwise the first ones will take over the whole marble.
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  #11  
Old 2008-06-03, 7:59am
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lay 2 dots for the anntena,implode,
then the main wings,implode,
then the back wings,implode,
lay on the body
ro
ive done many, they are just starting to turn out good. its much harder in a pendant than in a marble to get the depth.
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  #12  
Old 2008-06-03, 8:49am
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Yep what Chad said. Basically the rule is whatever you lay down first is going to be the highest in your marble. So I lay down the inside layer of petals first and implode those a tiny bit, then the stamen, then the outer layer of petals and so on.

Also, regarding flopping. I attach a 10mm rod to a 16mm rod and burn off a couple of inches of the 16mm rod to work with but I don't use the entire 16mm when I make my maria. This avoids the flopping around and also avoids using the glass where it is joined to the handle. If it does start flopping on you hold it upright and let it center back on the base.
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  #13  
Old 2008-06-03, 11:16am
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what Chad says

one thing that I picked up in Johns class was heating the back of the maria to melt in a line or pedal. you are not heating the rod just the back side of the tire effect and then lightly marvering in the design. seems to work well on problem glass that could boil or bubble with direct heat. once I get past those types of colors or the colors are then encased in glass i no longer worry about raging a hot flame on the front of the piece.

I tend to use a 16mm rod for pendants, and if the maria is getting floppy, I would think that you putting to much of the rod in the flame.
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  #14  
Old 2008-06-03, 2:10pm
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What wonderful information.....THANK YOU!
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  #15  
Old 2008-06-03, 3:04pm
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Ditto what Tiggy said!
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  #16  
Old 2008-06-04, 4:53am
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Great stuff! I am printing out this whole thread and taking it into the studio with me - if I ever get out in the studio. I so appreciate the tips!

Sandy
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  #17  
Old 2008-06-04, 3:10pm
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Also, if you are having problems with your punty or rod getting too hot and flopping around, hold a graphite marver in one hand and rest your punty on it as close to the piece you are working on as possible. That will suck the heat out of the glass and keep it from flopping around.

My paddle has a cutout just for that purpose.
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Old 2008-06-05, 5:16am
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Also, if you are having problems with your punty or rod getting too hot and flopping around, hold a graphite marver in one hand and rest your punty on it as close to the piece you are working on as possible. That will suck the heat out of the glass and keep it from flopping around.

My paddle has a cutout just for that purpose.
This is a great tip, it also helps when you crack off your final punty. Its usually a clean break if you've used your graphite.
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Old 2008-06-05, 12:51pm
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Oh boy you guys that got to take Kobuki are lucky! We had him scheduled to come to CT but with all of the physical problems at Tin City I decided to close before he got here. I sure wish there was some place locally where he could come and teach! He is a real nice guy to talk to on the phone. I hope he got outof the hospital and is ok!
Paula
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Old 2008-06-05, 3:24pm
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Lots of good information here. I appreciate everyones willingness to share and help the new people like me.
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Old 2008-06-05, 9:34pm
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Implosions are so 2007
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Old 2008-06-05, 9:53pm
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Oh boy you guys that got to take Kobuki are lucky! We had him scheduled to come to CT but with all of the physical problems at Tin City I decided to close before he got here. I sure wish there was some place locally where he could come and teach! He is a real nice guy to talk to on the phone. I hope he got outof the hospital and is ok!
Paula
Hey all,

Well Paula, maybe not exactly local for you but close! John Kobuki is coming here to Maine to teach at the end of this month!

The June 29-29 class is filled, but we still have a few seats left in the Monday June 30th class. There is a chance that we might add a Thurs-Fri class. Please be in touch NOW if this interests you, as we're booking flights.

We can't wait!

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Old 2008-06-05, 9:56pm
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John Kobuki has to be the best teacher ever! His classes are totally worth it, you guys are lucky in Maine.
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Old 2008-06-05, 9:57pm
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Quote:
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Implosions are so 2007
oddly, it was seeing one of your reef pendants that brought me over to the boro side of glass. dont know if I should curse you or thank you?
Still loving your work
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Old 2008-06-06, 11:21am
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Implosions are so 2007
Dangit always a day late and a dollar short .
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Old 2008-06-06, 9:41pm
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Implosions are so 2007
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Old 2008-06-07, 8:44pm
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Implosions are so 2007
Luckily for me, things here in Nebraska are always several years behind the rest of the world so I'll actually be ahead of the game.
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Old 2008-06-17, 11:33am
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Luckily for me, things here in Nebraska are always several years behind the rest of the world so I'll actually be ahead of the game.
Canada is even farther so that makes me a genius before my time.
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Old 2008-06-19, 2:26pm
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Canada is even farther so that makes me a genius before my time.
You're both lucky - I live in Portland where all kinds of cool stuff I don't know how to do yet is passe. Luckily I don't really care.
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