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  #31  
Old 2010-09-13, 12:25am
Reenie Reenie is offline
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I have 5 books full of different tutorials. I was buying everyone that came out until the price started to jump. (no offense to anyone as I know it's time consuming) but when you're on a budget, you sometime have to say no.

I do have to say that one of the tutorials that was mentioned in "not getting great results" for me was easy to get results. That would by Amy's Storm tutorial. I got the "storm effect" the very first try and using many of the colors that were mentioned. I do have a favorite "storming color" and that seems to be consistent each time.

I also have Annie's tutorials...tie dye, and others I can't remember the names, Mary Lockwood's, Loco's, Kerri Fuhr, someone who made demented fish , Sarah Hornik and OMG too many to list and have had much success with all of them. I'm struggling with the Dragon tutorial and a few of the boro tutorials though. But I keep trying
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  #32  
Old 2010-09-13, 12:37am
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It's a double-edged sword. As members of a community, we want to support fellow members (tutorial writers) but we'd also like to let fellow members (tutorial buyers) know if a tutorial wasn't really up to scratch. I can't see a way that anyone can win.

I've bought at least 49 tutorials, out of these 3 were disappointing. 2 due to very poor photography - one so dark it was pointless including the photos and the other so blurry that the details were lost (and details were a fairly necessary part of the process). I communicated this to the authors and nothing happened.

Another was due to lack of clear instruction and when questioned, the answer was about as clear as the instruction. I gave up on that one.

When reading the words of praise and adulation in the 'tutorials to purchase section' (and in other threads) from buyers of those 3 tutorials, I'm definitely not comfortable with the idea of sticking my head up and basically saying 'Excuse me, I found there was a little issue with.....'. No thanks. I did draw attention to the dark photographs in that one tut, politely and tactfully I hope; but I was really, really uncomfortable doing it.

So yes, I'd love to see reviews; but no, I'm not going to be the one flamed for reviewing. A no-win situation as far as I can see.

Marianne.
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  #33  
Old 2010-09-13, 7:04am
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exactly
who wants to walk into the fire first?

I probably will not be buying any more tutorials.
they are too expensive even with a discount.
not enough information to justify the cost plus printing ...JMO

I may not agree with everything that was said but defend her (his) right to say it.

I definitely think that Amy's tutorial was easy to follow and you can witness the results in the thread dedicated to storming.
so take it from there and consider the source.
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  #34  
Old 2010-09-13, 7:35am
Carols Glass Carols Glass is offline
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People do have a right to say it but it might not be the right thing to say.

I also had no trouble with the "Storming" technique, that is one of my favorite tutorials ever and I highly recommend it.
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  #35  
Old 2010-09-13, 8:52am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WildBird View Post
Amy Kinsch - Taking Reduction Glass by Storm
I didn’t have a lot of success with this technique. There could have been several reasons for this. But in my opinion only, I think with so many different types of silvered glass and inconsistency in production batches, amoung other things, this would have to be one of the hardest tutorials to try and create. I think my problem is that when one uses an oxygen generator with silver glasses, you just never know what you’re going to get, kinda like a ”‘box of chocolates”.
Please send me a PM or an email and I'll be more than happy to do some troubleshooting with you. I've definitely done my technique with bottled oxygen just fine and I think I've stormed every batch of OR ever made with good results. One "technical support call" to me and I may just be able to get you storming.
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  #36  
Old 2010-09-13, 8:54am
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Thanks for all the nice comments everyone. Remember, if you're having any problems just send me a PM or an email. I consider some technical support as part of the tutorial price.
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  #37  
Old 2010-09-14, 6:20am
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I think there is a line of separation between a tutorial being of good quality and whether or not the purchaser is inclined to the content provided in the tutorial.

As an example: I own almost all of Laurie Donnette's Tutorials. I love them all. I have been successful at all of them....except the darn Pansy! It has nothing at all to do with the tutorial or the content. Nothing. It is all me. I am just not getting my poor little pansy's to work. But as I said, all the other sculptural flowers I have made using her tut's have come to me quickly.

I liken it to going to a hair dresser with a photo of a hairstyle and asking for the same haircut. You may get the same haircut, but it is not going to look the same on you as it does on the person in the picture so it may be a bit disappointing. Doesn't mean you did not get a good cut, just means it wasn't for you.

Same with tut's. Just because you aren't getting the results, doesn't mean they were not written well. Not everyone is good at everything.
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  #38  
Old 2010-09-14, 6:39am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KJJames View Post
I think there is a line of separation between a tutorial being of good quality and whether or not the purchaser is inclined to the content provided in the tutorial.

As an example: I own almost all of Laurie Donnette's Tutorials. I love them all. I have been successful at all of them....except the darn Pansy! It has nothing at all to do with the tutorial or the content. Nothing. It is all me. I am just not getting my poor little pansy's to work. But as I said, all the other sculptural flowers I have made using her tut's have come to me quickly.

I liken it to going to a hair dresser with a photo of a hairstyle and asking for the same haircut. You may get the same haircut, but it is not going to look the same on you as it does on the person in the picture so it may be a bit disappointing. Doesn't mean you did not get a good cut, just means it wasn't for you.

Same with tut's. Just because you aren't getting the results, doesn't mean they were not written well. Not everyone is good at everything.
Excellent point!
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  #39  
Old 2010-09-14, 7:05am
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Personally, I buy tuts not to make the bead or do the exact same thing the author is doing (except the Storm beads!!)... I buy it for that little nugget of wisdom I find in each one that improves my overall beadmaking skills, no matter the style of bead.
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  #40  
Old 2010-09-14, 7:12am
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This is exactly why I purchase tutorials as well.


Quote:
Originally Posted by *Naos* View Post
Personally, I buy tuts not to make the bead or do the exact same thing the author is doing (except the Storm beads!!)... I buy it for that little nugget of wisdom I find in each one that improves my overall beadmaking skills, no matter the style of bead.
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  #41  
Old 2010-09-14, 7:51am
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Pia Kaven Pia Kaven is offline
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I jsut purchased the storming tutorial, and I am excited to try it. It looks good, I love how it is made. It is totally different story if I will get good results out of it. But that probably wouldnt have anything to do with the tutorial... I am just silver glass challenged!
Pia
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  #42  
Old 2010-09-14, 8:23am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carols Glass View Post
I don't believe that reviews should reflect one's inabilities to accomplish what has been demonstrated in the tutorials provided.

Maybe some guidelines on what to include and what to omit in constructive critiques would be in order here?

I think the tutorials are challenging but I know that it takes me more than one attempt or sometimes even two tries to make something remotely similar to the creations that have probably taken the artists who share their knowledge and techniques a long time to perfect themselves.
I so totally agree with this, especially the first paragraph. When I purchase a tutorial, I don't expect to make beads exactly like the author, sometimes it happens and sometimes I develop my own "creative twist" (which I feel make a tutorial a winner!). I think there is something to learn in every tutorial, something you didn't know or should be approached in a different way.

If I had to make a critique of any tutorial, my comment would be "close-up" pictures of what you are doing at the torch and using a lens, much like your didy's, so I can see what your doing in the torch. That would be my suggestion to anyone who is considering doing a tut. I think most people are visual learners and I need to get my nose right up in there. I think, as is the case with all tutorials, there is a learning curve.

I have Amys tutorial and consider it one of the best. I was able to storm pronto! Some glasses storm easier than others, sometimes you can be more impatient and hurry the process, etc. There is nothing I would complain about this tut.

The other tut mentioned was Anouk's making silver glass sing...if it wasn't for this tut, I would never have learned or understood how to use my silver glass. This has saved me so much money and all I can say is thank you, thank you.

My philosophy is that people who write tutorials didn't get to that point by one time picking up a rod of glass, putting it in the flame and Voila! It took them years to perfect that technique and I never get frustrated if I don't get it the first time....everything about glass is PPP....at the end of my torching session I always try to practice something.

So, in conclusion, the only problem with tutorials is in pictures. Directions are the hardest thing to write (I write beading patterns), what you take for granted, someone else doesn't, but pictures say it all.

Good luck to all who write them....I love everyone of them that I have purchased!!!

Kathie
www.flickr.com/godesigns
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  #43  
Old 2010-09-14, 8:40am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by piakaven View Post
I jsut purchased the storming tutorial, and I am excited to try it. It looks good, I love how it is made. It is totally different story if I will get good results out of it. But that probably wouldnt have anything to do with the tutorial... I am just silver glass challenged!
Pia
Pia, thanks for your purchase! I'm confident that you'll do fine and have fun with it but again...any questions please don't hesitate to ask me.
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  #44  
Old 2010-09-14, 8:41am
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Originally Posted by kk5336 View Post

I have Amys tutorial and consider it one of the best. I was able to storm pronto! Some glasses storm easier than others, sometimes you can be more impatient and hurry the process, etc. There is nothing I would complain about this tut.
Thank you Kathie!
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  #45  
Old 2010-09-14, 8:52am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yellowbird View Post

I probably will not be buying any more tutorials.
they are too expensive even with a discount.
not enough information to justify the cost plus printing ...JMO
Hmmmm. I sold all my tutorials almost all summer at half price...none of them exceeded $7.50. So you're saying that my secrets/tips/advice/knowledge shared aren't worth $7.50, 18 sheets of paper and some ink.

That kinda stings. I would think one bead sold from any of the techniques I've written about would pay for the tutorial. aka...worth it.

But I have to say, I hear people complain all the time about how much ink costs. I don't get that. I buy a $30 ink refill kit on eBay and it lasts me for a year. I printed at least 2 reams of paper full of stuff for VBS. I'm the secretary for the PTO, which means I print out a lot of flyers and colorful crap. The open house alone was 200 copies of the volunteers-needed flyer. Full color, front and back.

Where are these people buying their ink; Ft. Knox?

And Kimberly...if you hadn't included all the beginner information then the tutorial would have been limited to intermediate lampworkers only. You wanted to include information for as many people as possible and make it user friendly. I've never in my life heard anyone complain about getting too much information or too many images.

I can see where these 'reviews' can go south real fast.


It's not fun to wake up one morning and get emails letting me know that a prominent lampworker has smeared one of my tutorials in the newsletter she sends out to hundreds and hundreds of my potential customers- fellow lampworkers. Would be much worse to have found that posted publicly where everybody reads it...not just her email contact list. Wouldn't have mattered if it was accurate or not...it would be out there. Kinda like the U debacle...didn't matter that the stuff she wrote wasn't accurate people still didn't want it out there.

Constructive criticism and opinions should be sent directly to tutorial authors. Although I do recognize the value of knowing someone's pictures are blurry or the text is vague, those are facts, not opinions.
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  #46  
Old 2010-09-14, 9:19am
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I'm so sorry to hear that happened to you, Mary. Your tuts are very well written, great pics, and loaded with information. One thing I have to admit. Sometimes we are so anxious to get started we don't read every line. I have been making jellyfish beads since that tutorial came out. I never saw the line "encase the jelly tentacles". Even had discussions with you about them blending into the background. So there you are all that because I didn't read a few important words. I made new ones yesterday.
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  #47  
Old 2010-09-14, 9:36am
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encase the jelly tenacles........I know you didn't mean to do this, but isn't this a perfect example of telling a secret of the author? By publically reviewing a tut we could easily let info slip that the author worked hard to discover. Just sayin'
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  #48  
Old 2010-09-14, 9:39am
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I've been making buttons w/ Jo's button mandrel tutorial an love it! Very
clever, easy to use. I think I may be adding buttons to my list of sub-obsessions
(along w/ latticino, hollow beads and blown vessels!)

Re:reviewing tutorials... tread lightly. The fact of the matter is you can't
please everyone! Too many pictures?! I can't fathom that. The more the
better in my always humble opinion!

Happy glass to all

- Jill
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  #49  
Old 2010-09-14, 9:47am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hayley View Post
Unfortunately with a small community like ours where we all "know" each other, most will never write a review that's not positive.
Word.
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  #50  
Old 2010-09-14, 9:50am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kandice View Post
I would welcome any kind of review - good or bad. It would give me a chance to improve. I do have some nice comments on Etsy, even though I don't sell there anymore.
Why'd you stop selling on Etsy?
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  #51  
Old 2010-09-14, 9:59am
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After a bad experience with a tutorial, I came up with these criteria for future purchases:

Only buy tutorials that:

A) List the materials/tools needed

B) I can tell are techniques that offer something new or unique rather than things readily available in books and online

C) Offer a refund. If the seller is confident enough in their work they shouldn’t hesitate to offer a refund for non-satisfaction.
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  #52  
Old 2010-09-14, 11:02am
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Mary
Sorry I didn't mean you honestly I feel terrible . yikes
I have ever tutorial you wrote and they certainly were worth every penny.
I love them. and they were a great value.
again I'm sorry.
I don't think I can say that enough.
sorry
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  #53  
Old 2010-09-14, 11:17am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Laura B View Post
After a bad experience with a tutorial, I came up with these criteria for future purchases:

Only buy tutorials that:

A) List the materials/tools needed

B) I can tell are techniques that offer something new or unique rather than things readily available in books and online

C) Offer a refund. If the seller is confident enough in their work they shouldn’t hesitate to offer a refund for non-satisfaction.
You can't offer a refund on something like this. Once the product is downloaded, the person has it. If they don't like it, ask for a refund, then what happens to the copy they have? Do you use the honor system and ask them to shred it? Or send them the copy? There's still the downloaded copy in the computer.
I think this is the hardest part about the e books.

PS....Mary..your tutorials wasn't one one thing. You had tutorials that covered 10 tutorials in one bead. I think I have all of them and they are huge books!!
Also, in regards to printing.....it gets expensive for us that do not use our own printers. My printer ink for black is $24. and a bit more for color. I'd go through alot of ink if I printed it and being that it's not a laser printer, it would smear and stuff so I use lulu. They used to be really cheap but they've increased their price as well.
So If I bought 5 tutorials, uploaded them to Lulu for printing it would run anywhere from $30-$55 to print with a protected cover. So you add that and the cost of the tutorials and it's quite pricey.
That's why I would rather spend $15 on a book already printed but this is a discussion mentioned before about publishing a book and all that it involves.
I will still buy a tutorial but if it's running plus $20 then I have to really need it. Again no offense to anyone but if I can learn how to make a certain type of bead that eludes me, I'll buy it. If it's that much money to tell me how to make this color do this or that...to me that's a one time knowledge and then I won't use the book again if that makes sense. I love going back through my books and trying stuff again because I forget how but once I know how to work a glass color, then I'm usually good!
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  #54  
Old 2010-09-14, 11:33am
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  #55  
Old 2010-09-14, 11:36am
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Originally Posted by Reenie View Post
You can't offer a refund on something like this. Once the product is downloaded, the person has it. If they don't like it, ask for a refund, then what happens to the copy they have? Do you use the honor system and ask them to shred it? Or send them the copy? There's still the downloaded copy in the computer.
I think this is the hardest part about the e books.

I do offer refunds on my tutorials. Buying a tutorial is almost like buying blind. You are not in the bookstore able to see what is really in the book. I offer refunds because I want satisfied customers. If someone is dishonorable, that's on them.

I have been extremely fortunate with my customer base.

I don't expect people to be dishonest and I think the majority of people are quite honest.
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  #56  
Old 2010-09-14, 12:14pm
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A refund? I have to agree with Reenie on this one. How many people would read the tutorial and because it didn't work for them the very first time, turn around and ask for a refund?

I've bought at least 2 tutorials that I later regretted having bought, but I would never ask for a refund. I've read the tutorial and it's now in my head. Because I can remember it, the knowledge is there whether I try the technique or not.
I see your point. That makes perfect sense.

I had a bad experience with a tutorial once, but it had nothing to do with me not being able to do what was in the tutorial; it was because the tools needed to proceed with the tutorial were not listed and ended up being quite pricey... AND what was being demonstrated in the tutorial was nothing new. It was techniques you can find online a thousand times over.

I think that made me change how I feel about tutorials and refunds.
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  #57  
Old 2010-09-14, 12:36pm
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MelanieG MelanieG is offline
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I think the concept of reviews for tutorials is a good one in theory, but the problem with this, as with all reviews, is that the various consumers of tutorials seem to have different expectations of them. I've also seen in this thread that people providing 'reviews' don't always aim to be constructive or to explain the perspective from which they approached the tutorial in question.

I have almost perfect satisfaction with all of the tutorials I've bought. In some cases, it's not the tutorial itself but the things my brain does after reading it that has made it more than worth the money to have purchased it. I own a LOT of tutorials, and I think that it's a rare, cynical, close-minded individual that can't pick up $20 worth of information and/or entertainment from any of the tutorials that I've bought, and I think I have all of the tutorials that had stones cast at them so far in this thread in my vast collection.

In only one rare occasion out of the dozens of tutorial purchases I've made was I sad after buying a tutorial, but that was because I realized after buying it that I was already familiar with the technique discussed and the colours involved from a class I took with someone else and experimentation I'd done on my own. I wouldn't ask for a refund for this because I really should have known that was the case from the information that was provided with the tutorial sale.
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  #58  
Old 2010-09-14, 1:09pm
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gemsinbloom gemsinbloom is offline
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Which tutorials do you have? ( the tutorial addict is asking) hehe

Heaven forbid that I have missed one.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Laura B View Post
I do offer refunds on my tutorials. Buying a tutorial is almost like buying blind. You are not in the bookstore able to see what is really in the book. I offer refunds because I want satisfied customers. If someone is dishonorable, that's on them.

I have been extremely fortunate with my customer base.

I don't expect people to be dishonest and I think the majority of people are quite honest.
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  #59  
Old 2010-09-14, 1:18pm
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Laura B Laura B is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oenone View Post
...
In only one rare occasion out of the dozens of tutorial purchases I've made was I sad after buying a tutorial, but that was because I realized after buying it that I was already familiar with the technique discussed and the colours involved from a class I took with someone else and experimentation I'd done on my own. I wouldn't ask for a refund for this because I really should have known that was the case from the information that was provided with the tutorial sale.
Great point! And yes, particularly if the information provided at the POS was specific and detailed.

But, I learned a lot about what to look for when buying tutorials from that one bad experience.

Like just now... I was looking at a tutorial on Etsy. It's for a DIY necklace display. I had to email the seller and ask:
1) Is sewing involved
2) What would be the average cost of materials to make one

These are important questions to me as a customer, but may not have occured to the seller since she's so familiar with her product.

I think helpful feedback can improve a lot of tutorials and tutorial descriptions. Having someone see your tutorial NOT from your (the seller's) eyes.
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  #60  
Old 2010-09-14, 1:20pm
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Laura B Laura B is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gemsinbloom View Post
Which tutorials do you have? ( the tutorial addict is asking) hehe

Heaven forbid that I have missed one.
Oh, nothing for lampwork.

I have one for making Mandala designs in Photoshop

And I have one for pricing your jewelry.
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