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Tips, Techniques, and Questions -- Technical questions or tips |
2006-03-23, 12:18am
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Sep 03, 2005
Location: Sherman Oaks, Ca.
Posts: 353
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HELP New Kiln
The new kiln is out of the box (from Arrow Springs AF138 and I have the digital controller) but now what? Read the instructions a few times and I get a little more out of it each time I read and something is telling me its more fear stopping me (and time to play) but I still had a few questions, ok, confession, I’m scared, this puppy was expensive and I don't want to ruin it over my inexperience, so I am turning to all of you.
1 - Kiln Wash - use it, don’t use it - pros & cons
2 - Is there a Kiln paper? Should I use it? Why?
3 - Kiln soak times?
A - Times/Temp to put my beads I have made and never annealed
B - Times/Temp after finishing torching
C - Time/Temp if the kiln is on while I am torching
4 - Should there be a blanket or something on the bottom (read something
about marks on the beads if they are placed on the kiln floor...)
If not a blanket then?
I have read so many questions and answers on various threads that now I am totally confused. I know my controller has programed times, how do I know which to use?
Most of the glass I am using is Morretti, some Bulls eye, some Lausha.
Thanks for any and all help!
Angie
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2006-03-23, 12:20am
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Sep 03, 2005
Location: Sherman Oaks, Ca.
Posts: 353
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LOL at myself, I just saw that my title has been updated to a Senior Member! I wish I had "Senior" experience!
Angie
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2006-03-23, 4:52am
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Jun 15, 2005
Posts: 2,251
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I'll try to answer some of the questions, but I'm sure you will hear more than one answer to each question and you have to realize that everyone has their way and no one is wrong, just a different way.
So, my answers are:
1 - Kiln Wash - don’t use it - pros & cons - from my china painting days you never use a kiln that has had kiln wash in it because little flakes get airborne inside the hot atmosphere of the kiln and the bits and pieces can land on your beads.
2 - Is there a Kiln paper? There is a kiln paper, but if you are only annealing beads there is no reason for any floor covering.
3 - Kiln soak times- 15 minutes per quarter inch diameter of your bead - I use a minimum of 1 hour no matter how small the beads.
A - Times/Temp to put my beads I have made and never annealed - put them in at room temp and ramp over two to three hours to annealing temp
B - Times/Temp after finishing torching - hold for 1 hour, then ramp down at 100 degrees an hour, or variations thereof LOL
C - Time/Temp if the kiln is on while I am torching - okay, I am confused because B and C sound like the same things. I hold at 968.
4 - Should there be a blanket or something on the bottom (read something
about marks on the beads if they are placed on the kiln floor...)
If not a blanket then? Arrow Springs makes a form that you lay your beads across so that they are not touching the floor of the kiln.
Okay, out of here. I'm sure you will get lots of answers to choose from.
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Pam
"It is easier to perceive error than to find truth, for the former lies on the surface and is easily seen, while the latter lies in the depth, where few are willing to search for it." Johann Wolfgang Von Goeth
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2006-03-23, 8:33am
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Feverish Little Minx
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Join Date: Oct 07, 2005
Location: Midwest
Posts: 1,295
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Great questions Angie! I've been wondering the same questions, and after doing some research, I'm just kind of confused.
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~ Amber C
I'm all out of clever.
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2006-03-23, 8:46am
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Born Facing Left
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Join Date: Jun 13, 2005
Location: 1865 Miles Southeast of Dutch Harbor
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I would add to Pam's excellent answers only this:
I don't feel "safe" without some protection for the kiln floor. I've read about kiln malfunctions where temperatures spiked really high, and I believe that it's possible for molten glass to melt through the firebrick.
I"ve always used a layer of fiber blanket on the floor of my kiln, "just in case". (In a perfect world, one would be observing the kiln for the entire ramp down, to monitor temperatures, etc., but my world ain't perfect!)
I have to admit that I can't remember where I read that, so it's just become a habit for me.
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Sherry
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2006-03-23, 8:49am
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maybe tomorrow
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Join Date: Jun 17, 2005
Location: Carmichael, CA
Posts: 3,098
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I could be wrong, but I thought AS usually has the controller already programmed for annealing Moretti when they send out the kilns. You might want to just give them a call to be sure. If you need the program changed, I'm sure they'll walk you through it (or at least Craig will when he gets in.)
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2006-03-23, 12:53pm
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Sep 03, 2005
Location: Sherman Oaks, Ca.
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WOW! You guys are great THANK YOU! I think this weekend this baby will get a test run! As for the Kiln Paper is there a particular brand? Tried to log onto Arrowsprings last night but their site was down. Who else would have it?
Angie
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2006-03-23, 1:13pm
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Jul 05, 2005
Location: Texas
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No floor protection for me. It should have come with instructions on which program does what. I've got the Arrow Springs kiln too, and I love it! Craig talked me through programing it so I just walk up and hit start for fast ramp at the start of my session then when I finish for the day I put it on level 2. So easy.
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2006-03-23, 2:05pm
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The Crazy One
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Join Date: Jun 05, 2005
Location: Lococabana, OR
Posts: 7,008
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I use a blanket on the floor of my kiln because I do a bit of off mandrel work and a bit of boro. While I never had any marks from the fire brick before I put things in I do have a tendancy to toss some stuff in. Wooooooo I didn't think it was that hot! My kiln does not have a doggie door. Also I feel better if there was a melt down it may not be so bad. Yes wishful thinking but if it helps my sanity in any way I'm all for it!
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loco
Still crazy after all these years...
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2007-09-17, 6:06pm
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burnin' glass just becuz
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Join Date: Apr 16, 2006
Location: Ottawa, Canada
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hi! any updates to this thread? i just bought this kiln (no controller yet - another thing to save for! lol) it's sitting there looking at me and i have to admit i'm a bit nervous to fire it up in case i accidently have a meltdown and ruin it.
my fibre blanket is pretty thick, should i tear it in half? or does it need to remain at full thickness for adequate protection?
and any suggestions for how to program for annealing soft glass with just a digital pyrometer? the instructions i received weren't real clear and seemed more geared to a controller... i don't get to torch very often so i'll probably be batch annealing only once every week or two.
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2007-09-18, 3:50pm
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Missing presumed fed
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Join Date: Nov 15, 2005
Location: Wherever
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I don't think glass really melts through firebrick if you have a meltdown. It's just that if you have a meltdown and the glass hits bare firebrick, it might be hard to remove the glass without removing some of the firebrick with it. Firebrick is really porous, and if bits of glass ooze into the pores of the brick, you might lose a layer of brick or so. There are substances for patching firebrick, so it's not like your kiln would be totaled. If you do have a meltdown, you might want to get advice before attempting to remove the glass puddle. I think some ways are less likely to cause damage than others, but I don't recall what they are. (Meltdowns aren't frequent, but they do happen.)
The ramp and hold times will be the same for an infinite switch/pyrometer combination as for a digital controller. You just need to watch your switch and pyrometer to make sure it's ramping at the right rate and holding the right temp, and make adjustments to the switch as necessary. I don't batch anneal much, so I can't recommend a ramp rate, but I follow the same rule as Pam for holding time (1/4 hr for each 1/4 inch of thickness) and also use 968 as my annealing temp for soft glass. I ramp down from 968 to 800 over 2 hours. My kiln is firebrick and cools fairly slowly by itself, so at 800 I let it cool by itself, and don't open the kiln until it's under 100. (OK, I don't open until the next morning, and then it's under 100.)
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2007-09-19, 7:59am
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Feverish Little Minx
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Join Date: Oct 07, 2005
Location: Midwest
Posts: 1,295
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I can add something - I have an AS-138, and I do have some advice. When you are inserting the controller thermometer thingy into your kiln for the first time, make sure you push it all the way in. The first time I used my kiln, I didn't have the thermometer pushed all the way in....which gave a false temperature reading inside the kiln. Not sure what the actually temp inside the kiln was, but it was hot enough to melt my bead off the mandrel resulting in a little blob of melted glass on the bottom of my kiln floor. Luckily, it scraped right off (after it cooled), and didn't do any damage to my kiln floor. Fortunately, I was really nervous using the kiln for the first time and only annealed one bead. Had I annealed an entire batch - holy crap - that would have been a mess.
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~ Amber C
I'm all out of clever.
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