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Tips, Techniques, and Questions -- Technical questions or tips

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  #1  
Old 2015-10-15, 7:54pm
Whatzuhskrillex Whatzuhskrillex is offline
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Default Newbie question about Kilns!

So I recently bought everything I could ever need to start lampworking from Sundance Glass. But I have one particular question that I can't seem to find adequate information on. The question is in regards to the Bluebird XL electric kiln (which I'll admit is a bit bigger than I wanted, but the store talked me into it). I want to set up a studio in my room. That's right, my room. My garage is filled with a broken down car and other misc and I can't have it outside since I own two 100 lbs dogs that chew anything and everything. So I want to set it up in my room. I keep reading about ventilation and such. So my question is: If I have the kiln next to a window with an incredibly good fan blowing out the window will that be sufficient enough?

Thanks for any input y'all. Questions aside, I look forward to being active in the community
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  #2  
Old 2015-10-15, 7:57pm
Whatzuhskrillex Whatzuhskrillex is offline
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It's a decent sized room by the way and the kiln is on a large, custom table I built for lampworking and my other hobbies. It's also sitting on concrete. So it's pretty safe in my opinion. Im just not sure about ventilation and temperatures of the room.
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  #3  
Old 2015-10-15, 8:24pm
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allicat allicat is offline
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Be aware the kiln isn't as much an issue ventilation wise as is the glass melting at your torch. Many of the glasses are made with chemicals toxic to breathe (copper, cadmium and cobalt to name a few) and you definitely want adequate ventilation there as well! Do a search here on LE: there's a ton of threads about it and what you can do.

And...are you using a dual fuel torch? If so, you do NOT want a tank of propane in the house; on the off chance it blows you can kiss everything in house (including the people) goodbye. Those babies seriously explode.

Oooo, and what kind of pups??

HTH
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  #4  
Old 2015-10-15, 8:39pm
Whatzuhskrillex Whatzuhskrillex is offline
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Hey thanks for the reply! That definitely makes sense about the melting glass. But I'm thinking maybe I could just wear a mask. As far as the tanks, they will be far away from any heat and I also have flashback arrestors on the hoses for safety measures. I won't be using my torch too often since I'm in college. But my sister and mothers birthday are coming up (born on the same day, Oct 24) and I really want to create a silver fume implosion pendant for them and macrame a hemp necklace with custom beads. This is why I decided to come to the forums since It's incredibly hard to find detailed information on the internet.

The dogs names are Bubba and Bruce. Bubba is a pure bred Labrador and Bruce is a pure bred Pitbull. They have insanely good genetics, so they're both massive and muscular. They're also incredibly goofy and cowardly (My cat chases them around haha).

Thanks again for the reply. Look forward to chatting more with you and people of similar interests within the community
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  #5  
Old 2015-10-15, 8:54pm
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SassyGlass9 SassyGlass9 is offline
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I converted my downstairs bedroom into my studio. It's very doable.

I have TWO Bluebird kilns running, and two torches set up. Ventilation is definitely key, but there are all kinds of ways if you can't cut into the walls (my DH cut a small hole in the wall to run the hose from my propane into the room - the propane sits outside the room in the backyard in a wooden box. He cut a second, slightly larger hole in the wall to run ventilation.

But if you can't do that, you can do what I used to do before my DH hooked me up, lol. Take the screen off the window, run the hose out the window for your propane, having the propane tank outside, and get a good CFM squirrel cage fan and build a small platform for it just outside the window. Hook that up to 6" or 8" ducting and build a piece of wood that fits into the inside frame of the window and has a hole cut for the ducting. I would open the window, put the piece of plywood in, hook the ducting into it to vent out and connect to the fan, and then leave the bedroom door open as well, to get your make up air flow. You can also add a box fan in the doorway to increase the make up air.

You really don't want to just depend on wearing a mask as the fumes and off-gassing from the glass will not stay just inside your room, and it's a safety hazard for everyone in the house. There's a ton of great info here in the safety room as well, with a huge range of information and ideas on how to safely get yourself set up. It can be done on a budget, but safety is key.

Wish I had a picture of my old set up, but it's pretty easy to do - I did it by myself easily.

Welcome to the addiction!
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  #6  
Old 2015-10-15, 9:38pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Whatzuhskrillex View Post
I really want to create a silver fume implosion pendant for them
YOU NEED GOOD VENTILATION period
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  #7  
Old 2015-10-15, 11:09pm
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Even with a mask the fumes from the chemicals and the heavy metals in the glass will settle on surfaces in your home just like the dust in the air does but dust in the air is not poisonous.

It will get everywhere and it will wind up on your hands and in your food and your puppers and your kitty will ingest it all the time whenever they lick themselves.

There really is not any safe way around getting good ventilation unless you work outside to begin with.

Oh, And Welcome To The Addiction.

ETA: Silver fuming glass is one of the ones you really don't want to breath or eat. There is all kinds of medical evidence about silver smelters poisoning them selves.
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Last edited by Speedslug; 2015-10-15 at 11:11pm.
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  #8  
Old 2015-10-15, 11:41pm
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Otter's Flame Otter's Flame is offline
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Please do not take this the wrong way but the fact that your concern about ventilation centered on your kiln shows you really need much more information before you start actually melting glass. I know people in this thread have steered you in the right direction but PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE research ventilation and the need for proper ventilation much more thoroughly. Torch working can be an extremely toxic, hazardous endeavor and I know of at least two cases where it has been FATAL. Both the cases that were fatal were issues related to inadequate ventilation.

The combustion by product gases that are produced from burning propane or butane or natural gas in a torch are highly toxic. Breathing these gaseous by products can cause illness and or death. These gasses build up rapidly and you can actually die from carbon monoxide poisoning. There are other toxic gaseous by products from our torches as well. You MUST have adequate ventilation.

The elements that make up the colors in our glass are generally comprised of metals and salts. It would be advisable to research information on metals toxicity. Silver, gold, lead, tin, molybdenum, copper and the list goes on and on. As we heat glass we vaporize some traces of these metals. Without adequate ventilation we breath them into our lings. They can settle in the lings and also get directly into the bloodstream and build up in your organs (including your brain). They are highly toxic.

Even if you "use a mask" unless you are truly outfitted correctly with the proper industrial breathing apparatus you will still be breathing the toxic metals. Now assuming you had the right breathing equipment, this does nothing to evacuate the gases and vaporized metals. The metals will collect and concentrate and permeate the surfaces in your room. You will disturb them when any air moves tgrough and you will get them on your skin. Again, you will contaminate your body with toxic metals.

Adquate ventilation is an absolute imperative.


Otter
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  #9  
Old 2015-10-18, 8:44pm
losthelm losthelm is offline
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The kiln isn't really a problem with ventilation untill you start doing stuff besides basic beads.
The torch needs venting, even working a hot head with the windo open
can make you sick. Metal poisioning is cumulative, over time you become more suseptable.
The metal oxides take a long time to flush out of your system, some stick around for years.

At this point I would sugest working outside and batch annealing.
Its safe and fairly easy to setup. I use a pice of black steel under my torch and dydiniums when taking classes.
Annealing bubbles, pearlite, or fiber blanket should be enough to avoid breakage untill you anneal at your convince.

some glass also has a tendency to shock, flicking little bits across the room.
Not an issue if your vacuuming on concete but it can cause problems on carpet.
More so if it ends up on the furnature.

Over semester break you may want to clean enough space to work in the garage.

Your room can work for annealing and other steps
but there is a lot more work involved living and torching in the same space.
Not that you can't do it, its just the prep and pack up really eat into your torch time.

Also tanks in the home or attached garage can invalidate the insurance.

Most of us are fairly conscious of the dangers of the equipment and materials.
Its what keeps us safe when working with things that can explode, electrocute, or kill us in fun and intresting ways.
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